Approach for downlight install requests

[JohnS888]

Hi All

Just wondering how you guys approach requests for downlight installs. Upto now I only attempt them if have access to floor boards above or the ceiling has been temporarily dropped so have easy wiring access. If ceiling is the more modern suspended type ceiling obviously not a problem to wire them. But how do you access this to the point you feel comfortable going ahead with it. Concern is take on a job that appears to be suspended and has ease of wiring start chopping away for downlight holes and then find there's either wooden supports or some sort of hindrance for the wiring

 

[DPG]

When working there are more than Electrical regulations to consider. Now you are into a very separate set of operational parameters, building regulations, regulations for beams mean they have very strict allowances for width, depth and location of 'chipping out' or drilling holes, hence why it must not be done unless within said allowances (don't take my word for it look up the specifics), same as location of holes size and proximity etc. A structural beam providing support over an unsupported span is vulnerable to alterations outside of 'safe' zones causing weakness in relation to the location, loads, span and size of beam. This is why I personally never 'chip' out of the top or base of a beam, and instead factor it into the pricing and time, in my opinion it's not acceptable where one should be pricing to cover completing within full regulations. As I said earlier, my point 5 rare but possible, the unknown... The trick is to learn your materials/building fabrics and how long it takes you to achieve what your customer wants-remember to walk away, if you aren't able to do it in the budget they have them don't. Just how I work ??

Yes, obviously these things would still be born in mind, same as with any job.

 

[telectrix]

problem is with new build it;s not a case of make the structure as sound as possible, but what's the cheapest way to make it stay up till after the 10 year guarantee has expired. my mate done a new build last year. all the joists were 11" x 3", a bit over engineered, but at least we could drill all the holes without the building collapsing.

 

[Pretty Mouth]

you can also use earthed metal capping

I have a feeling this might not quite comply with 522.6.204. Which is a pity, as it would save a major headache on a job I have this coming week. A socket needs moving sideways a couple of feet on a stud wall. I'm expecting the cables to come up from the floor, the floor being finished oak there's no way I can lift it. Moving the socket will leave the cable out of the permitted zones for sure.

 

[loz2754]

I have a feeling this might not quite comply with 522.6.204. Which is a pity, as it would save a major headache on a job I have this coming week. A socket needs moving sideways a couple of feet on a stud wall. I'm expecting the cables to come up from the floor, the floor being finished oak there's no way I can lift it. Moving the socket will leave the cable out of the permitted zones for sure.

522.6.204 note (iv) allows for providing of mechanical protection sufficient to prevent penetration by nails etc. Although not mentioned in BS7671, a steel plate at least 3mm in thickness is deemed suitable.

 

[pc1966]

apart from which, it's farless likely to be screwed or nailed than a cable in a wall.not many customers want to hang pictures or fit shelves on a ceiling.

What about pole-dancing accessories? Or whatever BDSM fixings your better half wants...

 

[Pretty Mouth]

522.6.204 note (iv) allows for providing of mechanical protection sufficient to prevent penetration by nails etc. Although not mentioned in BS7671, a steel plate at least 3mm in thickness is deemed suitable.

Good call Loz, any idea where I could pick some up from? Builders merchants etc?

 

[pc1966]

Good call Loz, any idea where I could pick some up from? Builders merchants etc?

They don't say what thickness, but it is described for this job:

Cable Capping: Wiring Channel & Channelling

Shop our steel & PVC cable capping & channelling including wiring channel. NO MINIMUM ORDER, money back guarantee, FREE delivery over £50 ex VAT, 5⭐ reviews

www.discount-electrical.co.uk

 

[pc1966]

I have a feeling this might not quite comply with 522.6.204. Which is a pity, as it would save a major headache on a job I have this coming week. A socket needs moving sideways a couple of feet on a stud wall. I'm expecting the cables to come up from the floor, the floor being finished oak there's no way I can lift it. Moving the socket will leave the cable out of the permitted zones for sure.

Could you just link the two boxes with some steel conduit, or are they wanting the original box disappeared?

 

[telectrix]

Good call Loz, any idea where I could pick some up from? Builders merchants etc?

50mm x 152mm Safeplate Protector (Sold in 1's)

No Fixings required

www.cef.co.uk

 

[telectrix]

Could you just link the two boxes with some steel conduit, or are they wanting the original box disappeared?

set cable 50mm deep in stud wall.

 

[Pretty Mouth]

Could you just link the two boxes with some steel conduit, or are they wanting the original box disappeared?

Original box has to go. I think the product you linked to is what dusty dazzler meant, so I might just go with his plan. Perhaps not quite compliant, but is probably the most pragmatic solution

 

[pc1966]

Some 1.2mm thick stuff:

Rothley Galvanised Steel Multi-Purpose Flat Bar - 1m | Wickes.co.uk

Rothley Galvanised Steel Multi-Purpose Flat Bar - 1m

www.wickes.co.uk

 

[pc1966]

Original box has to go. I think the product you linked to is what dusty dazzler meant, so I might just go with his plan. Perhaps not quite compliant, but is probably the most pragmatic solution

You might be able to stack two of them for extra thickness.

But I guess if it is properly earthed then at least it will force disconnection even if someone keeps drilling/nailing against the resistance of the sheet.

 

[pc1966]

Here is some in 3mm as generic steel plate:

Galvanised Flat Bar 3mm thick 1.5m length | UK wide delivery

Buy mild steel galvanised flat bar 3mm thick online, available in 1.5m lengths. Or you can contact us on 01274 875479 to place your order. Delivery on orders over £99 + VAT is free to mainland England &

www.themetalstore.co.uk

 

[Pretty Mouth]

Thanks for the advice all, I've got a few options to work with there. And sorry for taking the thread off topic!