Crimping tool

[telectrix]

it's like comparing a Ferrari with a Reliant Robin. you get what you pay for.

 

[Mfctitch]

These are like Rolls Royce of crimps.

ho like those but any suggestions for uninsulated up to 16mm?

 

[Elecmox]

it's like comparing a Ferrari with a Reliant Robin. you get what you pay for.

Yes, but Ferrari is not worth it also.

 

[davesparks]

ho like those but any suggestions for uninsulated up to 16mm?

SWA (specialised wiring accessories, not the cable) do a good range of crimping tools at sensible prices.
I'm pretyy sure they are badge engineered copies of old BICC designs but I've never yet had a problem using them.
I've got the hex crimper which does 6 through 50mm uninsulated crimps and the indent crimper which does 6mm to 25mm (though I don't know where that one is at the moment)

 

[Pennywise]

ho like those but any suggestions for uninsulated up to 16mm?

I use these from Davico or they’re a rebranded version, perfect form factor as they are small and fit in a tool bag quite nicely as a lot of crimpers that go up to 16mm tend to be the larger boltcroper looking ones. Only downside is you need a little more wrist power ?

 

[Simon47]

Good quality tools are worth a lot of money, I buy good quality tools and they make my job quicker an easier so that I make more money.

It's not just that. Yes there's an element of "quicker and easier" which means you can do a better job and/or do it cheaper.
But IMO there's a MUCH more important factor - using the RIGHT tool for each job means doing a better quality job with less scope for damage or latent faults that will cause problems down the line.

My point about this specific tool is that they are just pliers shaped for one function that is not so complex and that they are charging it outrageously expensive and that is a rip off.

"Rip off" is a subjective term. Your perspective is as someone who only needs to do a small number of crimps - and doing them for yourself so YOU can make the value judgement as to how much to spend on tooling vs the risks of doing an inferior job vs the costs of doing it another way.
For most people in this thread, the vlaue judgement is not so much "how cheaply can I do these two crimps", but "what is the best value for a tool that will last a good few years, operate reliably, and do quality reliable crimps that won't cause me "warranty work" costs or reputation damage down the line.
And something you need to factor in to these "simple pliers" is that they are typically many stampings (or perhaps laser cut pieces) that need design and tooling, plus tooling for assembly, etc, etc - and all for a relatively low volume product. There's a difference between a pair of ordinary pliers that will sell many millions and a more complex crimper that will sell in the tens or perhaps hundreds of thousand units.
I've just grabbed my pair (admittedly not a particularly high spec) of insulated terminal crimpers to examine.
The plier type you first mentioned is basically 2 stamped steel plates, a rivet, and two plastic handle covers. A grand total of 5 parts.
This ratchet crimper (similar, but not identical to this one) has TEN (2 different shapes) stampings just for the crimp dies. Some designs have a pair of castings or forgings - but that is probably a higher tooling cost up-front. Some allow the dies to be swapped, allowing the use of one frame for multiple terminal types.
Then the frame has another eight stampings, plus a couple more for the ratchet assembly, plus (I think) twenty seven pins, screws, rivets, circlips. A couple of springs. ... And a couple of plastic handles.
So a total of 12 different stamped parts in a total of about 51 parts (and the one I've linked to above will have a couple more with being adjustable).
TEN times as many parts, made to tighter tolerances, IMO a bargain at the price they charge for it.

BTW, I don't have a lot of the tools others here do. I only do electrics as a "hobby", so I simply don't have the volume of work to justify the expenditure for many of them. For example, I don't have a PAT tester - I couldn't justify the cost, and will spend a little longer doing it the long way round using my MFT.
Many of the tools I do have, such as the MFT, I've picked up when I've seen bargains - IIRC the MFT was from a batch going cheap on eBay from a hire/testing house, presumably when they were upgrading their in-service stuff. It's not the best or fastest - but then I can afford to take a little longer on the low volume of work I do. Some tools I've made, some tools my late father made.

 

[Pete999]

OK, I'll rise the max price to 15 Euros. Give me valid reasons for the rest 35 Euros.

I'll not pay for crimping one wire a 5 euros as I didn't. I am sick of people overcharging stupid jobs. As I said, I bought solder iron, solder and holder for 7 euros and solder wires for myself. I did the job, and I learned soldering for future.

OK but did you use a lug, ferrule designed for soldering or did you butcher an insulated type of lug, ferrule?

 

[Elecmox]

OK but did you use a lug, ferrule designed for soldering or did you butcher an insulated type of lug, ferrule?

No, I soldered wires directly to the terminals of speakers.
Why would I use ferrule for soldering two wires if I can solder them by connecting?
[automerge]1591019129[/automerge]

It's not just that. Yes there's an element of "quicker and easier" which means you can do a better job and/or do it cheaper.
But IMO there's a MUCH more important factor - using the RIGHT tool for each job means doing a better quality job with less scope for damage or latent faults that will cause problems down the line.

"Rip off" is a subjective term. Your perspective is as someone who only needs to do a small number of crimps - and doing them for yourself so YOU can make the value judgement as to how much to spend on tooling vs the risks of doing an inferior job vs the costs of doing it another way.
For most people in this thread, the vlaue judgement is not so much "how cheaply can I do these two crimps", but "what is the best value for a tool that will last a good few years, operate reliably, and do quality reliable crimps that won't cause me "warranty work" costs or reputation damage down the line.
And something you need to factor in to these "simple pliers" is that they are typically many stampings (or perhaps laser cut pieces) that need design and tooling, plus tooling for assembly, etc, etc - and all for a relatively low volume product. There's a difference between a pair of ordinary pliers that will sell many millions and a more complex crimper that will sell in the tens or perhaps hundreds of thousand units.
I've just grabbed my pair (admittedly not a particularly high spec) of insulated terminal crimpers to examine.
The plier type you first mentioned is basically 2 stamped steel plates, a rivet, and two plastic handle covers. A grand total of 5 parts.
This ratchet crimper (similar, but not identical to this one) has TEN (2 different shapes) stampings just for the crimp dies. Some designs have a pair of castings or forgings - but that is probably a higher tooling cost up-front. Some allow the dies to be swapped, allowing the use of one frame for multiple terminal types.
Then the frame has another eight stampings, plus a couple more for the ratchet assembly, plus (I think) twenty seven pins, screws, rivets, circlips. A couple of springs. ... And a couple of plastic handles.
So a total of 12 different stamped parts in a total of about 51 parts (and the one I've linked to above will have a couple more with being adjustable).
TEN times as many parts, made to tighter tolerances, IMO a bargain at the price they charge for it.

BTW, I don't have a lot of the tools others here do. I only do electrics as a "hobby", so I simply don't have the volume of work to justify the expenditure for many of them. For example, I don't have a PAT tester - I couldn't justify the cost, and will spend a little longer doing it the long way round using my MFT.
Many of the tools I do have, such as the MFT, I've picked up when I've seen bargains - IIRC the MFT was from a batch going cheap on eBay from a hire/testing house, presumably when they were upgrading their in-service stuff. It's not the best or fastest - but then I can afford to take a little longer on the low volume of work I do. Some tools I've made, some tools my late father made.

Can you break down costs to material, labour... of how much you think it can cost?

 

[Pete999]

No, I soldered wires directly to the terminals of speakers.
Why would I use ferrule for soldering two wires if I can solder them by connecting?
[automerge]1591019129[/automerge]

Can you break down costs to material, labour... of how much you think it can cost?

So why have we been discussing crimping tools?

 

[Pennywise]

So why have we been discussing crimping tools?

I thought we were talking about speakers ?

 

[Pete999]

I thought we were talking about speakers ?

Judging by the number of replies and the title of this thread I will disagree with your reply Mate in all honesty it seems as though you are taking the Wee a bit in your reply, that, will teach me to try and be helpful won't it? maybe just stay out of this thread.
[automerge]1591026656[/automerge]

I thought we were talking about speakers ?

Speak for your self Mate. Maybe read the title before you post stupid replies.

 

[Pennywise]

Judging by the number of replies and the title of this thread I will disagree with your reply Mate in all honesty it seems as though you are taking the Wee a bit in your reply, that, will teach me to try and be helpful won't it? maybe just stay out of this thread.

Of course i was taking the pee but not you directly even if you were quoted , thought we were just joshing around, the thread was basically over in the first page or as soon as he said he'd soldered it, i have no idea why it's run to almost 100 posts but its most entertaining.

 

[Pete999]

Of course i was taking the pee but not you directly even if you were quoted , thought we were just joshing around, the thread was basically over in the first page or as soon as he said he'd soldered it, i have no idea why it's run to almost 100 posts but its most entertaining.

No me neither, no offence?

 

[pirate]

R&D have to be paid for. A smart set of crimpers may cost £20 to make, but may have cost thousands in development and testing and obtaining type approval etc.
I'm not an electrician, but when i do a job of which I consider myself capable, I like to use the correct tools. That way, the job is done properly, and there is no comeback for using poor practices, and those are important to me. I have 3 sets of crimpers, i use them occasionally, but I always know i have the right set for the job. The cost is outweighed by the confidence of a proper job.
similarly, I always have my PA Tester calibrated every year, whether i have tested 100 items or 1000. Why? Because then I know it is working correctly, and I can demonstrate that I have taken all reasonably steps.
I accept the OPs point that spending money on something he may seldom use is maybe an expensive way of doing a job, especially a one-off simple job, but then why baulk at paying someone to do it for you? Speaker cables are not particularly risky, but the cost of many sound systems and their accessories, especially speakers, can represent a large investment. if it's so important to have perfect connections (I doubt that) then the choice is clear.

 

[Elecmox]

R&D have to be paid for. A smart set of crimpers may cost £20 to make, but may have cost thousands in development and testing and obtaining type approval etc.
I'm not an electrician, but when i do a job of which I consider myself capable, I like to use the correct tools. That way, the job is done properly, and there is no comeback for using poor practices, and those are important to me. I have 3 sets of crimpers, i use them occasionally, but I always know i have the right set for the job. The cost is outweighed by the confidence of a proper job.
similarly, I always have my PA Tester calibrated every year, whether i have tested 100 items or 1000. Why? Because then I know it is working correctly, and I can demonstrate that I have taken all reasonably steps.
I accept the OPs point that spending money on something he may seldom use is maybe an expensive way of doing a job, especially a one-off simple job, but then why baulk at paying someone to do it for you? Speaker cables are not particularly risky, but the cost of many sound systems and their accessories, especially speakers, can represent a large investment. if it's so important to have perfect connections (I doubt that) then the choice is clear.

What R&D!? That aint space ship tool for astronauts to crimp wires in outer space to be researched for a year!
Is it hard to admit that I am right that this stupid plier thing is ripp off?
If you really think it's not then I am sorry that they are ripping you off without you being aware of it, no ofense.