Do you not feel that the term Electrical Trainee is derogatory

[trev]

But would the register prove the competence of the electrician doing the work, or the company he's working for?

Does the Gas Safe register prove the competency of the heating bloke who just turned up on your doorstep?

 

[Hawkmoon]

This seems to have got a bit PC - IMO it shouldn't be about protecting the feelings of someone who genuinely believed they were clever enough to cram 3 or 4 years training into a few weeks; I think a homeowner has a right to know that the person they hired believing to be an electrician, the proprietor of the company with the signwritten van out the front, obtained all their qualifications in a matter of weeks and was previously working as a bank clerk or taxi driver.

Einstein worked as a bank clerk...

I think the issue here is not what they did before but the lack of what education/experience they need to do what they propose now - 5 weeks - a joke!!!

 

[Adam W]

Does the Gas Safe register prove the competency of the heating bloke who just turned up on your doorstep?

I don't know. Does it?
I think a lot of customers assume that if someone is 'allowed' to turn up on someone's doorstep to start tinkering with their gas, plumbing, electrics or whatever, that 'someone' (probably the government) had already deemed them competent to do so, in the same way if you register with a new doctor or dentist you shouldn't have to look them up on the internet to see if they're competent. The problem being you can register with a part p organisation and call yourself a fully qualified accredited domestic installer after 5 weeks training, or even just that someone else who works for the same company fulfilled the criteria of the part p organisation.

 

[Adam W]

Einstein worked as a bank clerk...

I think the issue here is not what they did before but the lack of what education/experience they need to do what they propose now - 5 weeks - a joke!!!

But did working as a bank clerk mean that Einstein made a good electrician?

 

[Guest111]

Adam the gas safe qualification is for the engineer not the company,each engineer must hold his own gas safe qualification,this takes us back to the argument for 1 register for all electricians instead of the mess we have now,it works for gas and would work for electrics,the only thing stopping it is the financial aspect.

 

[plugsandsparks]

Does the Gas Safe register prove the competency of the heating bloke who just turned up on your doorstep?

Trev, the gas safe system really does appear to address the fundamental issue. With gas safe not only does the business have to be registered but also every engineer who works on gas has to be registered and his registration has to be relevant for the appliance he is working on. For an engineer to get registration he/she has to pass the mandatory qualifications which have a very high pass rate (100%). e.g. If you are registered for Domestic boilers, you cannot legally work on commercial boilers. if you are registered for small piped gas you cannot work on large piped gas etc etc. There is no comparison with the electrical industry really. BTW I have just registered Plugs and Sparks with Gas safe and am currently going through my training and it really is quite refreshing. Having said all that if a gas engineer drops one, it still is down to the competence on the day but at least the rules are crystal clear. I heard on the radio someone locally being jailed for 2 months for a dodgy gas install, so I think you will find its more than a little more robust than the electrical trade. Also in my dealings with gas safe when registering they are very very professional and know their stuff. So far quite impressed

 

[NickD]

IMO it shouldn't be about protecting the feelings of someone who genuinely believed they were clever enough to cram 3 or 4 years training into a few weeks.

Perhaps not, but implicit in the Electrical Trainee term is the assumption that anyone doing the five weeks is trying to cram it all into that five weeks from the ground up, and does not have any pre-existing knowledge, experience or qualifications to bring to the show. In effect that tars everyone who takes the short course route with the same brush regardless of whether their previous existence was as a pastry chef or chief engineer at Rolls Royce.

 

[Adam W]

Pastry chef, chief engineer at Rolls Royce, IT technician, brain surgeon... None of which have any previous electrical experience relevant to wiring up buildings, the difference being I would expect the pastry chef to be the one to know their place and realise they can't cut corners with their training.

 

[NickD]

I would expect the pastry chef to be the one to know their place.

How very Downton Abbey

 

[Engineer54]

Also I think the 2-3 year to 5 week comparison is flawed. those of you did CG2330 on evening college courses only did one evening a week (4 hours) and at least 6 weeks you don't go. So 46 x 0.5 days = 23 days a year (4.6 weeks). So a 2 year course would be less than 10 weeks at college. Not such a big gap now is it.

Most apprentices will be going to college 1 day plus evening per week. Or, and i don't know if this still exists ''block release'' where the apprentice will do block term's at college....

Then you will need to add into the equation the experiences being gained under the patronage and watchful eye of a qualified electrician.

So in my book there is really no comparison, considering that on completion of that 3/4/5 year apprenticeship you will,( or should be) leaving with a core Lv 3 electrical qualification AM2 and hopefully NVQ Lv 3!! Not just an add on 17th edition, PAT qualification, and a worthless Part Pee qualification.

What's more, how anyone in their right mind, can accredit the 17th and PAT qualifications as being even remotely close to being Level 3 standard, is totally beyond my understanding!! But this lunacy results in these wannabe's having two level 3 qualifications under their belt, 5 weeks after they gave up the Tesco Shelf packing job!!

 

[uksparks]

What's more, how anyone in their right mind, can accredit the 17th and PAT qualifications as being even remotely close to being Level 3 standard, is totally beyond my understanding!!

Shocking isn't it, it's sub level 1

 

[NickD]

What's more, how anyone in their right mind, can accredit the 17th and PAT qualifications as being even remotely close to being Level 3 standard, is totally beyond my understanding!! But this lunacy results in these wannabe's having two level 3 qualifications under their belt, 5 weeks after they gave up the Tesco Shelf packing job!!

From postman to PAT, one might say.

 

[uksparks]

From postman to PAT, one might say.

That's a great one that is.

 

[Meggerman]

Most apprentices will be going to college 1 day plus evening per week. Or, and i don't know if this still exists ''block release'' where the apprentice will do block term's at college....

Then you will need to add into the equation the experiences being gained under the patronage and watchful eye of a qualified electrician.

So in my book there is really no comparison, considering that on completion of that 3/4/5 year apprenticeship you will,( or should be) leaving with a core Lv 3 electrical qualification AM2 and hopefully NVQ Lv 3!! Not just an add on 17th edition, PAT qualification, and a worthless Part Pee qualification.

What's more, how anyone in their right mind, can accredit the 17th and PAT qualifications as being even remotely close to being Level 3 standard, is totally beyond my understanding!! But this lunacy results in these wannabe's having two level 3 qualifications under their belt, 5 weeks after they gave up the Tesco Shelf packing job!!

I agree with you entirely. I was not referring to apprentices I was referring to evening class students not working in the industry. An apprenticeship is the best training you can have (with a good firm anyway).

 

[Chrisuk]

I agree with you entirely. I was not referring to apprentices I was referring to evening class students not working in the industry. An apprenticeship is the best training you can have (with a good firm anyway).

With the evening classes like I'm doing we are told that any time during the 2 levels we need to find employment and do our nvq3, they said it can take 6 months if we have the work ask the way up to a year, although someone in here said they did it in 4 months
Although I have heard a few ppl go l self employed when only having level 2 and 3 2365 : shocked

Ps I'm only doing evenings because I can not find a firm to take on a mature apprenticeship