ELECSA Certification Scheme Elecsa Part P Assessment

[Engineer54]

I think your deluding yourself to some extent, maybe to substantiate the fee's your being charged!! There always were cowboys, whether trained cowboys or not!! There is no different now, you only have to read the posts on this and other forums to see that hasn't changed. Do you really think that it has stopped those ''anybodies'' from taking on electrical work in peoples houses since Part Pee??

Part Pee isn't a bad thing in it's essence but for whatever reason, ...has become nothing more than a Cash Cow machine. It has been well and truly high jacked by the unscrupulous providers and even the LABC's into squeezing as much cash out of this ledgistration as it possibly can!! There is absolutely no policing of the system whatsoever by the providers, or the LABC's the later hasn't the manpower to police it, and the providers don't want to lose face, on there so-called proven competent members being found out that they are Not Competent tradesmen at all.

So at the moment, you will still have to cough up your 450 odd quid for membership registration and i haven't quite made out as yet, if you also have to pay for your yearly assessment on top of that membership fee... If you do, ...hey-ho, more cash to cough up!! lol!! The truth is your all being led a merry dance on this Part Pee crap, what you really need is a National Register of Qualified Electricians, then you won't need these scammers to dishonestly in many cases prove your competence. Give that NRQE teeth and policing will be in place, very similar to what doctors and other professions already enjoy!!!

 

[Engineer54]

No not entirely, but they have had to at least shown some level of competence, rather than none at all. Just remember part p covers domestic only. I for one have no qualms over some "lesser" qualified people working in this small part of the industry. Get the basics right (polarity/cable size and termination/rcd installation etc) and the domestic set up is quite a basic and safe environment to work in. I don't think. Part p is great, But by default it's BETTER than what was there before >>>> nothing!!!

So what is the point of Part Pee then?? Geezus if it was as easy and as basic as your suggesting, how come some of these so called Part Pee competent electricians can make such a balls-up when they take on this basic work??

I really don't understand your reasoning, you complain about before Part Pee incompetent people could work on electrical installations, and in the next breath have no qualms about incompetent electricians being registered to undertake exactly the same work??? No wonder Part Pee is in such a god awful mess!!!

 

[mart1711]

You are taking my points entirely out of context. I used the term "lesser" in inverted commas for a reason as there was no real better description. You have used the word incompetent. I stand by what i have said. The domestic area of our industry is just one tiny part of it, and yes, it is a relitively basic part of it. Sorry you scoffed at this remark but it is indeed fact. If someone has shown to anyone (be that part p asessor or any other body for that matter) that they are capable of the skills required for doing a job then they should be allowed to do so. For domestic work, as said above, you would want them to have all the basic knowledge of cable selection, why we have and choice/selection of rcd's etc calculating disconnection times, checking efli and so on. There is no need to know the ins and outs of every electrical principle, or be over qualified. A couple of months ago i passed my 2391, this may be a good qualification to have on one of these schemes, but making that mandatory is a choice for whoever is in charge i guess. The schemes are also legally bound to ensure all contractors are covered by an insurance policy. This also is a good thing for all. Everyone knows in this day and age we live in world of blame culture. Everything has to have a paper trail and be recorded. This i believe is the main reason behind part p. Acoording to the fire brigades of the south east of england the aount of fires caused by electrical faults has been reduced by OVER 60% in the last ten years. Whether its part p or any other reason we are moving in the right direction!!

As a side note i subcontrated a job in London out to a firm in victoria last month as i had no time to complete it. They are NIC approved and the 3 guys who did the job were well into their 40's and were fully time served tradesmen.. So they said... The quality of the work was a disgrace. There were even necessary cpc's missing in 2 places. These so called experts had left a potentially dangerous installation. I have since emailed to complain and still am awaiting reply. Anyone can do things the right and wrong way!!!!

 

[Engineer54]

As a side note i subcontrated a job in London out to a firm in victoria last month as i had no time to complete it. They are NIC approved and the 3 guys who did the job were well into their 40's and were fully time served tradesmen.. So they said... The quality of the work was a disgrace. There were even necessary cpc's missing in 2 places. These so called experts had left a potentially dangerous installation. I have since emailed to complain and still am awaiting reply. Anyone can do things the right and wrong way!!!!

What can i say on the above??, ...I rest my case!!!

If you wrote to the NIC, you'll be waiting a very long time for that reply. ....And when you do, ...if you do, that reply isn't going to be to your liking either. They will do absolutly nothing, that goes for the LABC's too, that's a big part of the problem, nothing is being policed!! The only time you see the providers jumping into any action, is when there logo is being fraudulently used!! lol!!!

As for the rest of your post, yes insurance is a good thing to have behind you, but i wonder just how many successful claims have been made where so-called registered not-so competent electricians are conserned?? And do you really think that Part Pee has stopped the ''anybodies'' from still doing electrical work in the domestic sector, ....of course it hasn't!!!

Look, ....everything in the garden looks wonderful and rosy on paper regarding Part Pee, unfortunately that's where it stops on paper!! These organisations are only interested in what serves there purposes best, and that doesn't include the best interests of it's members, the electrical industry or Part Pee. If anything it has been detrimental to our industry, from segmentation, to the lowering of basic standards. Just look at the entry level, to become a so-called registered competent electrician for gods sake. These poorly trained people are getting into our industry via the back door, and more importantly into unsuspecting peoples homes!!

If you think that Part Pee has improved an electricians lot, you are very much in the minority. You really need to look at the bigger picture, the present system is just another nail going into the electrical industries coffin!!! It won't be too long, before You'll all be classified a semi skilled persons in the domestic sector!!!

 

[clicon357]

There's good and bad out there irrespective of their qualifications or membership of a scheme. One of the reasons I decided to get some electrical qualifications was that I'd ask 6 "electricians" the same question at work and get 6 different answers. I thought OK I'll get qualified and make my own decision from a point of knowledge. There was a 20mm steel conduit job at work (sockets and lights) and not having done it (conduit) before I offered to mate for the sparks doing it to gain experience. At the time I was mid-way through my Level 2 2330. This guy was 236, 2391, 16th, JIB etc etc and he was the "best" one there. We did the bending and fitting then ran all the single cores. Me being keen piped up "Do we test it now?" The guy looked at me and said "You can chuck a Martindale in if you want!". I thought that's not right so said "What about the lights?". He walked over to the switch, flicked it and said "Yep, they work!".

The other day on site I thought I smelt an electrical burning smell. Walked into the mess and said to the guy sitting there, his reponse, without taking his feet off the desk was "It'll still be there after lunch!"

 

[Engineer54]

clicon,

Your observations have always been the same throughout the ages. There has always been good and bad in every discipline. That has nothing to do with Part Pee being a crock of crap in it's present form though!! It's been turned into a money making machine, defeating the very purpose of it's original objectives. None of the organisations involved with this ledgistration has any interest or motivation to change what it has become, because it is what it is, ...a Cash Cow for them!!