First house, want to retrofit Underfloor Heating. Many Questions

[OnlyHumanHere]

Hi there,


So first things first, just bought myself my first house . 1920's build in Wiltshire. Should have the keys to it next week, can't wait.


Floor plan




First problem is, no gas mains in the village. This means it currently has an immersion heater to supply hot water , storage heaters for heat and the oven/hob connected to gas bottles stored outside on the side of the house.


So, after doing a bit of research and planning with my wife, we want to scrap the storage heaters and go for water UFH with a free floating 8mm laminate flooring Something on the lines of this . Looking around, I think prowarm seem to do a good job with supplying all the parts we need, being bought from Theunderfloorheatingstore (regarded fairly highly online and seemed very helpful on the phone).


Now, my main concern is what to do with the heating element. I've spoken to a few specialists and I've been told either keep the immersion heater for the sink/bath water and get something like a 'Slim Jim' electric boiler for the UFH. Obviously the guy that recommended that was the website that sells it. However, again it's reviewed rather well and it'd be nice to keep all the product coming from one place.


Another plumber I spoke to recommended to scrap the immersion heater and get a combi boiler. He did say that if it was him, he would probably look at LPG combi boilers over an electric boiler for the long term cost saving (did a bit of research and yes, lpg is much cheaper than electric). However, when it comes to boilers, I'm completely lost as to what I need.


So my questions are...


* Keep the immersion tank or scrap it?
* Get an LPG combi boiler, electric combi boiler or just a stand along boiler for the UFH and keep the immersion tank.
* If I was to take the immersion tank out, should I put the new boiler in it's place? If so, would I need 1 or 2 UFH manifolds for each floor?
* I was thinking about putting the whole system (manifold and boiler) under the stairs, would that make sense?
* Apart from the kitchen (which is tiled) and the reception (which is original parquet), the rest of the house is carpeted, is it relatively straight forward to just rip the carpet up, lay down the floating floor, insert piping, cover and just throw the laminate on top?
* One guy I spoke to said I would probably need to manifolds, 1 for each floor. Is that right?
* rippiing up the Parquet and tiles in the kitchen, is there anything I should know before doing so?


I plan to try and get most the humping and dumping, laying the insulation for the piping, the piping and laminating myself, however I will be getting professional help for the installation and testing of the equipment.




Final Question, with multizone UFH...is the NEST thermostat (Gen 2) still a good option?






I hope I haven't made things too complicated.












TL: DR....Want to install UFH, in the UK, what is a recommended brand? Should I scrap my Immersion heater for an electric or LPG combi heater? Is it all worth it?

 

[davesparks]

Agreed, so let's move forward.

My biggest issue still hasn't been resolved.

Let's ignore the pros and cons of UFH and whether it'll be worth it.

Let's say all of a sudden it is worth it and it's a great idea that'll be easy and simple.

My next concern is the boiler. Since I don't have space for a big tank in the garden for LPG, the cooker is LPG supplied via bottles stored on the side of the house..the bottles are only domestic, maybe about 19kg size.

How much and how long does it normally take to fit a combi boiler?

Fitting the boiler itself takes maybe an hour, but then you have install all of the pipework to it, wire it, flush, fill, test, commission etc etc etc.

But if you can get a proper gas tank installed then you won't be wanting a gas boiler, you'll be changing bottles every other day!

 

[OnlyHumanHere]

Fitting the boiler itself takes maybe an hour, but then you have install all of the pipework to it, wire it, flush, fill, test, commission etc etc etc.

But if you can get a proper gas tank installed then you won't be wanting a gas boiler, you'll be changing bottles every other day!

Yea, I'm swaying to the idea of spending a bit of extra and getting a an electric boiler with indirect cylinder and scrapping the immersion heater.


I'm guessing that it shouldn't be too hard to replace the immersion heater since the piping will be in that area anyway.

I'm currently paying well over the odds in my current residence for gas and electric so no matter what I do I'll definitely be saving money.

 

[davesparks]

Electric Combis have come leaps and bounds in the last few years...

I'm guessing that it shouldn't be too hard to replace the immersion heater with a combi since most/all the piping will be in that area anyway.

Have they? What leaps and bounds would they be?

Guess again! The current hot water cylinder will be fed from a header tank above at low pressure with low pressure outgoing hot water. The combi will need a cold main and has a higher pressure hot water outlet, plus a relatively large electricity supply running to it.

 

[sean_ork]

Third time lucky maybe .......

What's the EPC rating of the house ?

 

[OnlyHumanHere]

Have they? What leaps and bounds would they be?

Guess again! The current hot water cylinder will be fed from a header tank above at low pressure with low pressure outgoing hot water. The combi will need a cold main and has a higher pressure hot water outlet, plus a relatively large electricity supply running to it.

ignore that comment, I'm an idiot. Just spoke to the electric heating company, they've recommended a comet 12kw boiler with 180L indirect cylinder.

looks like it'll do the job Indirect Cylinder Packages - The Electric Heating Company

 

[OnlyHumanHere]

without looking at the survey report I've no idea, apologies.

 

[telectrix]

that boiler will cost approx. £1.80 per hour running at 12kW. assuming it's on only 40% of the time ( which is optimistic in winter) that equates to about £120 per week.

 

[Midwest]

OP I don't know where your getting your briefing from about wet UFH. The concept, as far as I'm aware, is constant heating of the room temperature from the floor up, as opposed to the convection nature of wall hung rads. It not a quick heat up and cool down. The UFH pipes are installed to heat up the screed floor, to act as the heat source, which is not instant. The plastic pipes are not designed to heat the room themselves. Without insulation below the installed pipes, you will be doing exactly what say you don't want to happen, heat the ground below.

 

[sean_ork]

without looking at the survey report I've no idea, apologies.

I'm guessing this is the first house you've purchased ?

The EPC rating is a fairly vital piece of information, it should help guide you to where you need to spend money first.

Forget fancy remote control heating controls, forget electric boilers, forget those dangerous heat mats - spend your money on the fabric of the house first.

Please dig out your house buyers report and let us know its rating.

 

[davesparks]

that boiler will cost approx. £1.80 per hour running at 12kW. assuming it's on only 40% of the time ( which is optimistic in winter) that equates to about £120 per week.

But with a decent solid mass of screed around the ufh pipes and good insulation under them he'll get a pretty efficient system that only the water heated up to about 40 degrees......
.....
Oh no, wait a minute,
....
He's using magical heat reflecting snake oil! Forget that thought then.

 

[sean_ork]

ignore that comment, I'm an idiot. Just spoke to the electric heating company, they've recommended a comet 12kw boiler with 180L indirect cylinder.

looks like it'll do the job Indirect Cylinder Packages - The Electric Heating Company

What process did they use to calculate the energy requirement for your house ?

I'm guessing the wetfingerinair approach.

 

[davesparks]

What process did they use to calculate the energy requirement for your house ?

I'm guessing the wetfingerinair approach.

There are actually two really simple equations you can use for doing those calculations.
1: monthly sales target - units sold this month = boiler required
Or
2: what have we got an overstock of in the warehouse which needs shifting + know it all customer = kerching

 

[UNG]

I found this link quite interesting while I was looking at comparison costs of fuels used for domestic heating

 

[sean_ork]

I found this link quite interesting while I was looking at comparison costs of fuels used for domestic heating

Find a few links comparing the price of mains gas v LPG v electric and heating oil (sec28)

I'd bet he'll be wanting an oil boiler .....

 

[UNG]

We are up to page 6 of thread which parts haven't you understood so far, your specialist has told you that you don't need insulation and you came back with that typical military attitude telling us that we were all wrong

With your response I feel it is time this thread was closed as you seem to be having some / a lot of difficulty understanding what has been posted to date

Can I respectfully suggest that you take your research and questions somewhere else so that we don't have to waste our time and read your verbal diarrhoea