Gender Neutral Confusion..............

[Marvo]

In this neck of the woods Dave you wouldn't guilt anyone into anything or be making any kind of political statement by declaring gender neutral, like I say nobody I've spoken to has any idea even what it is.

It probably shouldn't have any bearing on their suitability for the job but why would they go out of their way to state it when it wasn't an option on the form we sent them?

I know it would be a paperwork issue, we have to declare on official forms the number of male, female, black, white, coloured and disabled emplyees for purposes of complying with the employment equity act and there's no accomodation for any genders other than male and female. Kinda ironic really when the employment equity act was passed with the purpose of 'guaranteeing non-discrimination on the basis of race, gender, age, political opinion and religious beliefs'

 

[westward10]

This persons gender is one or the other not sitting on a fence. If they have pointed this out with no prompting I sense trouble ahead.

 

[Wilko]

You haven't asked about their gender assignment, but it has been put on the table and they are probably very nervous about things. That said, I'd get professional recruitment advice to ensure the process is in accord with your local anti discrimination laws.

 

[littlespark]

It's a crazy fad that he (I assume he's a he to look at?) will regret in a few years time. Like when everyone tried to write 'Jedi' in the religion section of some official forms to make it an actual religion.
Wait... "Gender neutral" ? - In an electrical forum? Is someone taking the P?

 

[Pete999]

Okay, this may not be the right forum to ask this question but I figured you guys in the UK are on the cutting edge of political correctness so I'll give it a go.

I had a job applicant send me a resume/CV and on it he states he's 'gender neutral'. I'll be the first to admit I'm not up to speed with all the new terminology and the first thing that sprung to mind was it was a guy who'd had his male parts removed or maybe a girl who had changed sex or something similar. After asking my office staff who were more clueless than I was I approached our third party HR advisors and they also couldn't give me any answers apart from it's not legally recognised here. I ended up googling it and to be completely honest I'm still as confused as I was to begin with.

If a guy says he's gender neutral (he looks very much like a guy from his photo) is he saying he doesn't want to be considered as a male by others purely from a social stance or is there a physical element to this like he's taking hormones or having/had surgery or is it something else entirely?

Gender neutrality - Wikipedia - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_neutrality
This any help Marvo?

 

[Marvo]

Nope, didn't help Pete. There's too many other terms I'm not familiar with and I didn't get clear answers to the basic questions in the opening post.

 

[Pete999]

Nope, didn't help Pete. There's too many other terms I'm not familiar with and I didn't get clear answers to the basic questions in the opening post.

Difficult one Mate, it would be a mine field of hurt if the applicant was denied the job because of a Gender issue, if as you say he does look feminine then i could an issue for both of you. Best offer I have, would be to see him again, with a witness and ask him what he means by his Gender Neutrality statement, could ask one of your 3rd party HR colleagues to be the witness, I know when I was interviewing people, we had a case of one chap who had actually taken the plunge and had surgery, it was explain to him of the possible pitfalls of traveling countries, not as enlightened as this one, good luck mate, sorry I could not be of any more help.

 

[Squid]

For a start he'll have mental health issues so be wary that if you did employ them as a company how much support you would have to give then i.e. time off and financially, if you are a small company it could hurt you financially. Brutal but true.

 

[westward10]

Difficult one Mate, it would be a mine field of hurt if the applicant was denied the job because of a Gender issue, if as you say he does look feminine then i could an issue for both of you. Best offer I have, would be to see him again, with a witness and ask him what he means by his Gender Neutrality statement, could ask one of your 3rd party HR colleagues to be the witness, I know when I was interviewing people, we had a case of one chap who had actually taken the plunge and had surgery, it was explain to him of the possible pitfalls of traveling countries, not as enlightened as this one, good luck mate, sorry I could not be of any more help.

Why would you need a witness that is immediately classing them as being "different" when in fact they are no different to you or I. Most of these individuals want to be treated like anyone else and why not because they are but by highlighting this indicates to me further issues along the line. By all means interview them and try not to confuse style over intent.

 

[Pete999]

Why would you need a witness that is immediately classing them as being "different" when in fact they are no different to you or I. Most of these individuals want to be treated like anyone else and why not because they are but by highlighting this indicates to me further issues along the line. By all means interview them and try not to confuse style over intent.

Why would you need a witness? because if the person with the issues says or infers that something has been said said that causes offence it could be misconstrued as sexist or any other such ist you can imagine.

Just the interviewee and the interviewer together it would or could be their word against yours, believe me I have been there, with two people on the interviewers side you are at least protected against any accusations, by all means ask the interviewee if he or she has any objections if a colleague sits in on the interview, I believe it's called covering your backside.

 

[Cadgey123]

Look at the animosity this thread is causing?

The guy/chick hasn't even been seen or heard yet in real life. Give the applicant a chance for f*** sake.
If you don't like them sack them off after and say, " Thanks for coming"

We are intolerable people in society and if it doesn't fit in with our 'normal' lives, we start to panic!!

 

[Midwest]

Firstly this should have no bearing on their suitability for the job, judge their application and CV exactly the same as all of the others, and if they are worth an interview then invite them to do so.

Interview them exactly as you would anyone else. Then after the interview explain to them that you don't fully understand what gender neutrality is but that you didn't mention it until after the interview because it has no bearing on their suitability for the job.

If they are genuine then they will appreciate this, if they are abusing the situation to attempt to guilt you into giving them the job or wanting to make political statements etc then they won't appreciate it and will try to cause a fuss. But because you did treat them exactly the same as everyone else's they won't have a leg to stand on if they attempt to make something of it.

I'm not an expert on the subject, but I do know a little bit about it and I have a few friends who know more than I do.

I could write many pages on the subject but I'll restrain myself for now.

Difficult one Mate, it would be a mine field of hurt if the applicant was denied the job because of a Gender issue, if as you say he does look feminine then i could an issue for both of you. Best offer I have, would be to see him again, with a witness and ask him what he means by his Gender Neutrality statement, could ask one of your 3rd party HR colleagues to be the witness, I know when I was interviewing people, we had a case of one chap who had actually taken the plunge and had surgery, it was explain to him of the possible pitfalls of traveling countries, not as enlightened as this one, good luck mate, sorry I could not be of any more help.

In this neck of the woods Dave you wouldn't guilt anyone into anything or be making any kind of political statement by declaring gender neutral, like I say nobody I've spoken to has any idea even what it is.

It probably shouldn't have any bearing on their suitability for the job but why would they go out of their way to state it when it wasn't an option on the form we sent them?

I know it would be a paperwork issue, we have to declare on official forms the number of male, female, black, white, coloured and disabled emplyees for purposes of complying with the employment equity act and there's no accomodation for any genders other than male and female. Kinda ironic really when the employment equity act was passed with the purpose of 'guaranteeing non-discrimination on the basis of race, gender, age, political opinion and religious beliefs'

Marvo I think the advice given by davesparks is most sensible. To do anything else would not be. Your applicant may have had other job interviews, having not mentioned the gender neutral aspect has created an unnecessary complication, this person is at least being honest. As Pete advised as well. Last few interviews I had, always had three members, consisting of company representatives and HR manager.

I understand the points and views the others have made regarding employment on a small company, but as you've said yourself, make any discrimination of anyone would set you up for a fall.

 

[Pete999]

Look at the animosity this thread is causing?

The guy/chick hasn't even been seen or heard yet in real life. Give the applicant a chance for f*** sake.
If you don't like them sack them off after and say, " Thanks for coming"

We are intolerable people in society and if it doesn't fit in with our 'normal' lives, we start to panic!!

Don't think there is any animosity in this thread, questions have been asked some have been answered, employers have to be careful and mindful of peoples differences, your method of dealing with the issue, "sack them off" well I had better not say what I think.

 

[Richard Burns]

From a general perspective I think that unless you are experiencing these approaches it can be difficult to understand at least for an older generation.

From a practical perspective you need to consider if this person has the qualifications and or experience that you are looking for, if not, then the question becomes moot.
If you are considering interviewing them then you just take their approach into consideration in how you frame questions so as not to apply a gender bias.
I generally feel that he and him are general terms that also happen to mean male but this is not generally accepted by anyone with a specific gender identification.
I would consider using a name or speaking in the third person for an interview, "you" is gender neutral.
From a statistical perspective a count of male and female people would be on a biological basis not a mental basis.

As a gender neutral person they are simply saying they are not male and they are not female, and generally not happy with being identified as either.
Probably from a practical point of view they are merely normal people with a different mind set.

Good luck.

 

[Squid]

Look at the animosity this thread is causing?

The guy/chick hasn't even been seen or heard yet in real life. Give the applicant a chance for f*** sake.
If you don't like them sack them off after and say, " Thanks for coming"

We are intolerable people in society and if it doesn't fit in with our 'normal' lives, we start to panic!!

The OP is in South Africa, certain things need another 20 years to catch up with the "enlightened" UK