help needed very quickly,

[leekemp85]

I have very nearly completed a rewire of a two bed-roomed bungalow, as this was a friend of mine I charged £1400 all in, not a bad price as it took two of us a week (I have been paid already). since I have not been there for the last week the plumber has told the lady that he has spoken to his electrician and I have broken every rule in the regs and has threaten to get an inspector in unless I give £500 cash back tomorrow.
Candie is in the middle so unsure if to believe the plumber or me.
the thing i have done wrong are.
not taken fly leads to the back boxes,
the boxes have not got grommets, this is something I always do but I did not have any on the first fix I was going to do it on second fix but my mate connected the sockets up I totally forgot about it (but is that against the regs?).
there are a few cables close to the surface all in the correct zones I have bonded/ undercoated with plaster, when the finished cote is applied they cables will be fully concealed.
and that is the minimum distance for a socket from a tap.
please be honest with your answers as I will print this off tonight and will be going around tomorrow with it tomorrow.
I have offered to correct the problems (for nothing) but have been told by the plumber that his electrician will do it and finish the work and testing for £500. and he doesnt want me in the house again just the money and the key.
please give your views asap, and what could happen if a inspector did come around to see the problems if I cant cant sort them I am currently with elesca.

thanks and sorry for the long post

 

[flukey]

Wet plaster needs capped or protected another way incase of damage during the plastering process.

Dot and dab boarding doesn`t need capping

capping is good practice, nothing to stop being plastered in if you are filling your own chases.

not that i wouldnt fit it or atleast a bit of oval

 

[leekemp85]

Wet plaster needs capped or protected another way incase of damage during the plastering process.

Dot and dab boarding doesn`t need capping

I havent heard of that one before, i plastered the under cote just needs a skim

 

[flukey]

that bit sounds fine to me lee.

stick the grommets and fly leads in and everyones happy

 

[m4tty]

Sound like someone needs weighing in mate .... get him round a pals house for a quote and payback is sweet really irritates me when people bitch like this about other peoples work ffs. Id be checking his work out too

 

[Davey101]

First off, I'd suggest a punch to the face.
Secondly, fly leads are not needed, its not in the regs, and just about every spark I know is aware that you dont have to use flyleads, although some still like to use them, saying its good practice. The earth for the back box is provided by the 3.5mm screws being in contact with the brass rings that are connected to the earth terminal (hope that makes sense).

Grommets- To be honest, the boxes should have these, as you already know. Not sure exactly how the regs cover this though. It is probably just covered under 'erection methods'. Personaly, I dont think its that important (I'm sure most others will disagree strongly), but if I came across a job that didn't have any at all, I might look at the rest of the installation a little harder. Your explanation seems reasonable to me. I was picked up on an inspection recently- one of my ko boxes didnt have a grommet in, as I had ran out of them, and didnt get round to putting one in.

Not sure about the tap question, I presume you meant to say 'what is the minimum distance' ?
This has changed a couple of times over the years (or at least the common understanding of the requirements have changed). As I understand it, there is no minimum requirement as such. Apparently the NICEIC recommends 300mm, which I presume is measured from the edge of the sink/draining board. Where you might get caught is if you install it behind the sink, in which case the socket would not be suitable for the location it is installed in, due to the fact it is likely to be splashed (unless it is a splashproof socket of course).

In my OPINION, if it is at least outside of the perimeter of the sink (and preferably 6" away), then I wouldnt fail it. If its behind the sink or draining board, I think you may be out of luck.

Again, not sure about the cable question, but I presume that you have chased the wall out, installed your T+E, then plastered it. I also presume you haven't used capping? Again, only my opinion, but I think its always best to use capping (I have instaalled cables without a long time ago, but wouldnt do it now). If its your house, do it how you want, but if its for someone else, then its good practice to use it.
Saying that, you haven't broken any regs, so its no problem. As for the cables 'poking out', again, no problem, as long as you cant see them when you have finished (and even then its nothing to do with regs, just rough work!)

If I were you I would ask the other spark to qoute the reg numbers relating to the 'problems' that he has identified. Its not good enough for him to say 'its rough', 'the regs says this or that', without actually proving it.
Take a deep breath, relax and sort any problems that you may have overlooked.

On the plus side, its nice of him to snag it for you

Edit- Bloody hell, thought I'd get in first, haven't you lot got anything better to do!
Agree with others, sounds like he is either an A**h***, or trying to drum up some buisness. The plaster/flylead thing is a bit of a joke- the sockets really need turning off, or making safe with a bag/tape etc. If he's happy to plaster live (a lot of decent plasters are, and thats their choice), then its up to him, you shouldn't have to alter your installation because of it.

 

[leekemp85]

I will be going around tomorrow morning to try and sort it out, can any one give a web site or a reg that states that the things I have done are are not against the regs there was some paper work a few years ago from the nic that stated codes that are not codes I cant find it now. I can remember fly leads and grommets are not coded as long as the double insulation enters the back box with the grommet issue. I know bad its bad practice to nit install grommets and if i saw some one's work with out them i would say its ruff but it was a mistake that i could easily sort out,

 

[Jonesy83]

hes trying it on by the sounds of it trying to drum up work

 

[Des 56]

I have very nearly completed a rewire of a two bed-roomed bungalow, as this was a friend of mine I charged £1400 all in, not a bad price as it took two of us a week (I have been paid already). since I have not been there for the last week the plumber has told the lady that he has spoken to his electrician and I have broken every rule in the regs and has threaten to get an inspector in unless I give £500 cash back tomorrow.
Candie is in the middle so unsure if to believe the plumber or me.
the thing i have done wrong are.
not taken fly leads to the back boxes,
the boxes have not got grommets, this is something I always do but I did not have any on the first fix I was going to do it on second fix but my mate connected the sockets up I totally forgot about it (but is that against the regs?).
there are a few cables close to the surface all in the correct zones I have bonded/ undercoated with plaster, when the finished cote is applied they cables will be fully concealed.
and that is the minimum distance for a socket from a tap.
please be honest with your answers as I will print this off tonight and will be going around tomorrow with it tomorrow.
I have offered to correct the problems (for nothing) but have been told by the plumber that his electrician will do it and finish the work and testing for £500. and he doesnt want me in the house again just the money and the key.
please give your views asap, and what could happen if a inspector did come around to see the problems if I cant cant sort them I am currently with elesca.

thanks and sorry for the long post

1 Fly leads to back boxes are not required if there is one fixed lug
2 Grommetts are fitted because a cable may be damaged during installation,if there is no damage and there is to be no movement of the cables,then it is just not good practice
3 Cables can be clipped direct,or buried in plaster,the plaster provides no protection so the depth of the unfinished covering is irrelevant
4 Capping is not a requirement,it is temporary protection from damage by the trowelling and is a conveniant way of fixing cables
5 There is no minimum distance from the tap to the socket
There is a recomended distance of 300mm,it is a recomendation,the socket would not be suitable for the environment if it were closer(blank it off or fit a fused spur if its too close)
6 The plasterer should not be working on a live installation where water and damage can occur
(make dead any live parts, for the work to continue and until it is tested and safe to energise)
7 Any deviations from the regs and any work you deem necessary,do this as and if you decide when it should be done)You are certifiying the installation and as long as there is no danger to other workers
a plea of mind your own F---g buisness should suffice
8 The installation is nothing whatsoever to do with them,you have no reason to listen to or accept critisism off them
9 On completion,the installation should comply with building regs and Bs 7671
On completion,make sure that it does.
If another party wants a third party inspection,that is their buisness and at their cost


You may have done less of a standard of good practice than perhaps you normally would. because you are aware of whats been critisised,but regulations do not seem to have been flouted and other trades are perhaps not the ideal people to advise on work that they are unfamilliar with

 

[Spudnik]

I agree with the points that have been raised here.

It DOES sound like the plumbers mate has no work so its a few quid for him.

If there are any non compliances, then ask HIM for the regs thats have been contravened.

You could of course call the plumbers bluff by going to site and speaking with Elecsa and booking the inspection in front of him.

You could always give HIM the phone and he can book it direct.

Stand your ground. You have done nothing wrong.

By all means, print out the thread and show him.

 

[UNG]

Makes me wonder how many times this plumber / electrician team have pulled this stunt and got away with it. This sounds a bit to organised to me, plumber speaks to his electrician mate (who from reading the original post has not been to site) and condemed the installation on the plumbers say so and given a price for rectification work. £500 sounds a bit much to sort out a few minor issues

This is some friend you have done the work for if they are allowing another tradesman to bully you for a "discount" now the work is more or less complete with a few minor issues

Stand your ground, tell the plumber to call the inspector in, speak with your inspecting body and tell them that you have been threatened and are not being allowed back on site to sort the minor defects and complete the work and that they may receive a call

As an aside has the plumber done any gas work and is he GasSafe registered and does his work comply with the necessary regs and bylaws, May be he would welcome an inspection of his work

Don't let them screw you, fight back

 

[solo2771]

It's no wonder that plumbers are all loaded (seen the scams on TV)
Paul.

 

[leekemp85]

Andy "the plumber" is also a friend of candies, the person i am working for. its just a shame that other trades men would say things like this to try and give me a bad name. I know there are a few minor problems that were just a mistake and would be easliery sorted out, i'm not a cowboy in anyway, i take pride my work.

 

[kduck]

The plumber is trying it on mate. "His electrician will do it and finish the work and testing for £500."His electrician would be the one breaking the law as he did not do the work you can only certified your own work ,did his electrician forgot this ???????????????????????, if your work was so bad do you think the other spark would want to put his name to it. In the eyes of the law you have the right to put correct any problems that have been point out to you before any action is taken against you.

 

[acat]

Might be an idea if you also spoke to Trading Standards as a previous post stated this sounds to be well organised con by the other two and £500 to finish off and certify someone elses work If they have done this before they will do it again and again.


Chris

 

[UNG]

Might be an idea if you also spoke to Trading Standards as a previous post stated this sounds to be well organised con by the other two and £500 to finish off and certify someone elses work If they have done this before they will do it again and again.


Chris

I was thinking more of an anonymous call to HMRC