In defence of the short course trainee

[down2earth]

i might also like to add that i dont have any issues with anyone trying to better themaelves.....its the 5 week courses and the content of em.....and the companies/organisations behind em......promising 50K plus a year and all that nonsense......

That was really my point at the start of the thread, us Electrical Trainee's have if anything been mis sold the courses, having been through the process (and paid the money) I am amazed that this ever got through legislation now I know how much I don't know (if you see what I mean).

 

[Octopus]

Cripes 10 pages in and at this moment 13 people viewing!

 

[kung]

Dammmmmmmmmm in all this exitement reading all this i picked up me coffee and missed me mouth !!!!!!!!! arhhhhhhhhh all down the front of me best top ! better not do any testing today just in case i miss the CU and stick the probes in the cutout !

 

[UNG]

Dammmmmmmmmm in all this exitement reading all this i picked up me coffee and missed me mouth !!!!!!!!! arhhhhhhhhh all down the front of me best top ! better not do any testing today just in case i miss the CU and stick the probes in the cutout !

Obviously some retraining needed here in coffee drinking :lol::lol::lol:

 

[Dave 85]

I agree with you about the hostility, its not necessary
For me its not so much about how long you're at college for. The full 2330 teaches you a hell of a lot of stuff that, to be frank, you are never going to need as a domestic sparky (three phase motors, power factor correction and the like). I'd say its more about experience working with someone. You could go to college for 10 years and they still wouldn't teach you how to re-wire a house. I would definetly recommend at least 6 months full time work with a decent sparky before you start trying to do to much work on your own.

With regards to dumbing down the industry-My experience is that the work I see which is done in blue and brown T&E is generally done to a far better standard than the old stuff. I personally find that Part P has scared off a lot of the builders, kitchen fitters, cowboys etc. I know it also scared off a lot of sparkies approaching retirement age, but im not complaining.

 

[trev]

I agree with you about the hostility, its not necessary
For me its not so much about how long you're at college for. The full 2330 teaches you a hell of a lot of stuff that, to be frank, you are never going to need as a domestic sparky(three phase motors, power factor correction and the like)
I agree but 2330 is not intended to spit out housebashers.
I'd say its more about experience working with someone. You could go to college for 10 years and they still wouldn't teach you how to re-wire a house. I would definetly recommend at least 6 months full time work with a decent sparky before you start trying to do to much work on your own.

With regards to dumbing down the industry-My experience is that the work I see which is done in blue and brown T&E is generally done to a far better standard than the old stuff. I personally find that Part P has scared off a lot of the builders, kitchen fitters, cowboys etc. I know it also scared off a lot of sparkies approaching retirement age, but im not complaining.

Part P has not scared off any builders, kitchen fitters or cowboys mate at least not in my experience. If anything it has confirmed to all and sundry that "It's just a few wires, you don't need to know any of that other nonsense"
Or in other words it has demeaned the trade that took me a long time and a lot of effort to become qualified in

 

[Specialist]

Part P has not scared off any builders, kitchen fitters or cowboys mate at least not in my experience. If anything it has confirmed to all and sundry that "It's just a few wires, you don't need to know any of that other nonsense"
Or in other words it has demeaned the trade that took me a long time and a lot of effort to become qualified in

:hurray::icon14: Nor has it stopped any of them in my experience either. Dave 85 you say there's a lot of stuff you don't need to know to be a DI, but what happens when the DI's start running out of work (There's only so much to go round & there's more & more of them on what seems a Daily basis) & decide to play with 3 phase ? It's only a couple more wires after all so how hard can it be ?

 

[UNG]

I agree with you about the hostility, its not necessary
For me its not so much about how long you're at college for. The full 2330 teaches you a hell of a lot of stuff that, to be frank, you are never going to need as a domestic sparky (three phase motors, power factor correction and the like). I'd say its more about experience working with someone. You could go to college for 10 years and they still wouldn't teach you how to re-wire a house. I would definetly recommend at least 6 months full time work with a decent sparky before you start trying to do to much work on your own.

With regard to the hostility it probably isn't warranted but it is a two way thing the number of times the experienced guy's on here have chosen not to reply to some of the unnecessary questions that are asked and the OP comes back on an hour or two later demanding in what I take as a hostile manner an answer and then get's offended by the hostile response

With regard to the "I don't need to know about 3 phase as a DI " when all domestic properties are part of a three phase system and there can be faults attributable to a failure in the three phase system that appear in the single phase supply in a domestic property (floating neutral to name one) seems a little ignorant due possibly to some missing knowledge that wasn't taught during your course. I have worked on some medium to large domestic properties where the supply was three phase due to the extravagances of owners with electric everything

With regards to dumbing down the industry-My experience is that the work I see which is done in blue and brown T&E is generally done to a far better standard than the old stuff. I personally find that Part P has scared off a lot of the builders, kitchen fitters, cowboys etc. I know it also scared off a lot of sparkies approaching retirement age, but im not complaining.

Most of the blue / brown T&E has been installed to the 17th edition regs the old red / black T&E could have been installed as far back as 14th and possibly end of the 13th edition regs and the installation modified over the years so I don't believe that is a good guide to higher standards.

May be the sparks approaching retirement are at the one course / exam too many stage and called it day like the close to retirement gas fitters did back in the late eighties when there was major change in there industry

 

[Dave 85]

That is where your experiences and mine differ. I am constantly hearing the phrase "well we're not allowed to touch it anymore cos of that part p thing" With regards to a DI having a pop at 3 phase, well technically by law a 17 yr old with a driving liscence can drive a 400bhp subaru impreza. Doesnt mean its a good idea. Personally Im fully 2330 level 3, 17th ed etc but I stick to what I know. Houses. Someone asks me to do work on 3 phase, I say no thanks.

 

[kung]

play with 3 phase ? It's only a couple more wires after all so how hard can it be ?

Try sticking their fingers across 2 phases ! unlike single phase.

 

[Specialist]

Try sticking their fingers across 2 phases ! unlike single phase.

Ooh stop putting ideas in my head:devil::lol::devil2:

 

[UNG]

That is where your experiences and mine differ. I am constantly hearing the phrase "well we're not allowed to touch it anymore cos of that part p thing" With regards to a DI having a pop at 3 phase, well technically by law a 17 yr old with a driving liscence can drive a 400bhp subaru impreza. Doesnt mean its a good idea. Personally Im fully 2330 level 3, 17th ed etc but I stick to what I know. Houses. Someone asks me to do work on 3 phase, I say no thanks.

Don't understand what a 400 horse Subaru has got to do with working on three phase and what you are trying to say, I've worked with three phase in industrial, commercial and domestic properties since I was 16. When all supplies are derived from three phase it's good to understand how it works and what faults can occur in single phase systems if something fails in the supply system

If you were asked to do some work on a domestic property that had a three phase supply would you turn it down even though you are "fully" 2330 etc qualified

 

[UNG]

Try sticking their fingers across 2 phases ! unlike single phase.

Would you do it with a floating neutral on a single phase supply

 

[Guest112]

i dont understand some peoples confusion/fear of three phase??>/

 

[mechelec]

I think it would be better to have a domestic installers forum !


That is a great idea. The blind leading the blind lol