Leaving Rings behind going Radials ????

[Robinson]

Just pondering as a lecturer mentioned to me ideally that industry would like to phase Rings out and go down just the radial route in domestic environment

How do you guys feel? any of you already really trying to go down this rd..? say the kitchen for appliances on separate 16amp supplies. or anywhere else come to mention it.

Obviously in these times in could be more costly but is it better in the long run????
IMO much better but maybe unrealistic for many jobs.

 

[millwall ken]

Millwal ken

2.5, 4, depends on design!! U can do a 20A radial (usually) in 2.5

Or a 32A radial in 4.

Chears fella

 

[electromonkey]

IMO, there's a place for both. 3 bedrooms, 4 S/O in total.... radial. 4 S/O for kitchen appliances.... ring final. each installation should be designed on it's merits, allowing for increased loading i future.

Absolutely! This is part of an electricians job. DESIGN and installation.

 

[davelerave]

both-depending on

we've got tighter rules on ring finals over here(ROI) than the UK as well

 

[Engineer54]

both-depending on we've got tighter rules on ring finals over here(ROI) than the UK as well

Can you enlighten us on these tighter rules in the ROI?? ...I'd be interested to know what they are.

 

[truckster]

Absolute tosh!! So now we are governed by what a DIY'er may or may not do are we??? And, ....I suppose they don't add or muck about with radials then do they??....

To some extent we are, that's why we are the pros and the public are 'ordinary people' Part of our job is to protect the public from themselves. It is more likely that a ring cct will be abused to a dangerous degree than a radial.
I am not saying don't use rings, I use them for kitchens because of the loading but you are going to find that radials are coming

 

[SPARTYKUS]

I have, in the past, fitted a kitchen ring (ring), in 4mm2. Yes thats right. Not in the book that one. Like lots of other things you can do if you wish!

Main reason was person it was for had a load in garage so used it. Zs figures were nice

No chance of an overload there.... (on a 32a mcb)

 

[Engineer54]

To some extent we are, that's why we are the pros and the public are 'ordinary people' Part of our job is to protect the public from themselves. It is more likely that a ring cct will be abused to a dangerous degree than a radial.
I am not saying don't use rings, I use them for kitchens because of the loading but you are going to find that radials are coming

I know what your saying here, But you can't protect against all the idiots and fools in this life. We have more than enough responsibility on our shoulders, to take on anymore, especially this type of responsibility. So i can't agree at all, with having DIY'ers dictate in any way the design criteria and installation of circuits in a installation...

All circuits whether Ring or radial, should be based purely on the sound design of the needs of that installation. Like others here i have nothing against using either, i just don't agree with ditching a perfectly sound and a proved circuit design, just for the sake of it, laziness or through lack of skill. .....And definitely not on the basis of what a DIY'er may or may not do at a later date, that's the DIY'ers responsibility not the electricians.

It's not just rings they play around with either, i've seen almost every s/outlet in a small sized 30's house supplied by a single radial circuit, and when the MCB tripped a few times with each additional outlet so the MCB got changed for a higher rating, ...that was before his house nearly burnt down. Long story, but this particular guy actually rewired his house replacing like for like as he went along. 1 x lighting circuit, 1 x c/u, 2 x radial circuits in a 6 way MCB CU. Never bothered to utilise the two spare ways in the CU either!!! Like i say, you just cannot protect against idiots like this,...they will always win, ..or should i say lose!! lol!!!

 

[Robinson]

I know what your saying here, But you can't protect against all the idiots and fools in this life. We have more than enough responsibility on our shoulders, to take on anymore, especially this type of responsibility. So i can't agree at all, with having DIY'ers dictate in any way the design criteria and installation of circuits in a installation...

All circuits whether Ring or radial, should be based purely on the sound design of the needs of that installation. Like others here i have nothing against using either, i just don't agree with ditching a perfectly sound and a proved circuit design, just for the sake of it, laziness or through lack of skill. .....And definitely not on the basis of what a DIY'er may or may not do at a later date, that's the DIY'ers responsibility not the electricians.

It's not just rings they play around with either, i've seen almost every s/outlet in a small sized 30's house supplied by a single radial circuit, and when the MCB tripped a few times with each additional outlet so the MCB got changed for a higher rating, ...that was before his house nearly burnt down. Long story, but this particular guy actually rewired his house replacing like for like as he went along. 1 x lighting circuit, 1 x c/u, 2 x radial circuits in a 6 way MCB CU. Never bothered to utilise the two spare ways in the CU either!!! Like i say, you just cannot protect against idiots like this,...they will always win, ..or should i say lose!! lol!!!

Yes i have to agree here, no matter whether they phase out or not. we still going to have lunatics doing these thoughtless jobs whether the owner DIY OR a non comp cowboy.

I do think in gen Radials should be brought into the design maybe alittle more often, but certainly as engineer says dont think rings should be outted because of the twits out there. they are going to be twits regardless.

"All circuits whether Ring or radial, should be based purely on the sound design of the needs of that installation" AGREE.

 

[davelerave]

Can you enlighten us on these tighter rules in the ROI?? ...I'd be interested to know what they are.

for 13amp socket circuits

-no unfused spurs

-no rings serving kitchens

 

[Engineer54]

What's the reasoning behind ''No ring circuits in Kitchens''?? I would have thought a Ring circuit in a kitchen is an ideal design consideration, considering the differing types of load etc!!

 

[telectrix]

what do you use for a kitchen then, a square?

 

[Robinson]

for 13amp socket circuits

-no unfused spurs

-no rings serving kitchens

No rings in Kitchens ! wow . now that i dont get, so i guessing they be insisting on 4mm usage only. If anywhere the kitchen i would have a ring. as i said in begin of this thread i recent done/doing a kitch but i split main app's and sockets. Apps (fridge, freezer, DW, WM all on radials). rest kitchen on a ring ie. sockets that could have a juicy kettle, george forman multi grill, microwave, coffee machine, juicer. these posh people have all this on the go with their kids. !

 

[Knobhead]

The eurocrats will ruin this country. And the idle ones that don’t want the hassle of testing a ring main will let them.

Next it will be the 13A fused plug, one of the safest in the world correctly fused.

Unified colours! Total lunacy, but the UK just wagged it’s tail and rolled over!

I recently got a call to a place I worked at many years ago. A gang of contractors were installing a new cable in to a switchboard I installed 20+ years ago. Only 2 new cables had been added in all that time, it looked a bl**dy nightmare! Miniform gear doesn’t have a lot of room to spare in the terminal chamber, but with blues and blacks mixed up it’s an accident waiting to happen.

View attachment 5736

 

[davelerave]

What's the reasoning behind ''No ring circuits in Kitchens''?? I would have thought a Ring circuit in a kitchen is an ideal design consideration, considering the differing types of load etc!!

i'll come back to ya when i have a definitive answer

i'm with my friend stella at the moment

 

[truckster]

Next it will be the 13A fused plug, one of the safest in the world correctly fused.

Unified colours! Total lunacy, but the UK just wagged it’s tail and rolled over!

13A sockets are already being discussed in some media, importers want everything the same

UK rolled over? No, mais oui! Belle de jour! It's what we do best nowadays, BOHICA!