Spot the mistakes!

[TaffyDuck]

Well there is no way your average Joe Public is going to know that there is no such thing as a Visual anywhere in BS if people are dishing these out with Company names and Part P logo`s. Lets face it a PIR/EICR is 5 pages of figures and ticks that only a competent person is going to understand.
I for one feel that there is a place for something similar to this to cover, as said above, changeover of tenancy between full tests but it needs to include a section for RCD operation at least and make it clear that it is not a legal document. A PIR is after all just a report not a certificate and there is a difference legally there.
I would be happy to use something like this if I had carried out a full inspection in the past. To do one on a 1st visit is daft.

 

[oldtimer]

I dont think the regerstration companies realise this is undermining their own EICR system I for one will tell customers and letting agents to get written confirmation that they are legal plus if it is in their documentation there should be a standard set out for everyone either way this does not make them look like they are in control.

 

[oldtimer]

I have just posted this on the Volyimum forum ask the experts

Is there such a thing as a Domestic Visual Condition Report ?

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I have recently got sight of a Domestic Visual Condition Report that has a registration logo on it and also quotes compliance with BS7671 ? To me it looks like a cut down version of an EICR now my understanding is we have the EICR so can I ask the experts is this document legal and why is it included in the electronic certificate software that is supplied by some registration companies. These appear to be getting used for rental properties and are being requested by letting agents so can you shed some light on these please

 

[Tonkatoy27]

Good luck getting a letting company or landlord to pay for yearly VIR's, I can't even get landlords to do an EICR every 5 years let alone a yearly check as well. The landlord's I speak to (try to sell EICR's to) are well aware that there is no legal requirement to carry any electrical testing out.

 

[oldtimer]

Good luck getting a letting company or landlord to pay for yearly VIR's, I can't even get landlords to do an EICR every 5 years let alone a yearly check as well. The landlord's I speak to (try to sell EICR's to) are well aware that there is no legal requirement to carry any electrical testing out.

Just a wee correction here I am not saying a VDCR every year but every change of occupancy so for some properties that may be never where others it could be every 6 months and yes I agree they know they dont need to get a EICR or even the VDCR butthis could be a thing that insurance companies that would drive a bit like smoke detectors in the States where you dont want to fit them ok your policy is $1500 but if you do fit them then $900

 

[mackers]

it does comply as its a VISUAL report ONLY based on facts in 7671


and Easy Cert are running it as the NIC produced the Original form!!

yep, ive got a set of niceic originals cant see what all the fuss is as you say VISUAL REPORT
visual being,
no earthing,no earth to lights, exposed live parts etc
we recommend you get ABC done blah blah blah

 

[oldtimer]

yep, ive got a set of niceic originals cant see what all the fuss is as you say VISUAL REPORT
visual being,
no earthing,no earth to lights, exposed live parts etc
we recommend you get ABC done blah blah blah

Could you pm me a copy and maybe its me but why was this not set up in the BGB to give it some authority as it has thrown me but I am no longer geting surprised they spent 2 years getting the PIR replacement in place and screwed that up so is there any other certificates that we should be aware of. Because to me this is just going to undermine the very high standard EICR they are pushing as it does not take an idiot to say mmmm £170 for a EICR O well I will just have a £50 VDCR economice 1 standards 0

 

[Adam W]

From HSBC.com

"There are three levels of survey:

• Basic valuation: this is carried out on behalf of the mortgage lender. Fees are dependent on the purchase price of the property and range from £125 upwards.
• Homebuyer report: this is intended to provide an overview on the general condition of the property. Generally, a surface examination of the parts of the property that are visible and readily accessible is carried out, and services are inspected but not tested. Homebuyer reports tend to be carried out on properties less than 90 years old.
• Full structural survey: this is also known as a building survey and is a more detailed report on the property. It is carried out by a surveyor rather than a valuer. They tend to be carried out on properties more than 90 years old, listed buildings or buildings that have any unusual constructions. If the surveyor does not discover any major defects, they would be liable and you may be able to claim compensation."

The electrical element of a 'homebuyer's report' sounds like a 'visual only' inspection to me. Whether there is a latent defect which would need to be identified with testing and later renders the inspection "not worth the paper it's written on" is a risk the homeowner takes to save a bit of money, but as mackers says a visual inspection will give a professional opinion of the installation and pick up most faults or potential hazards.

 

[mackers]

Could you pm me a copy and maybe its me but why was this not set up in the BGB to give it some authority as it has thrown me but I am no longer geting surprised they spent 2 years getting the PIR replacement in place and screwed that up so is there any other certificates that we should be aware of. Because to me this is just going to undermine the very high standard EICR they are pushing as it does not take an idiot to say mmmm £170 for a EICR O well I will just have a £50 VDCR economice 1 standards 0

ill try there at work so be after easter but these babies have been out way before the eicr was even thought about!

 

[Nivag316]

Probably a highly trained Part P(iss take)

 

[Baconhead]

DVCR Cert

 

[rich.250]

How big a plug top do you need to fit a 60Amp BS1362 fuse into it?:stuart:

Glad someone else seen that. Lol.
Although a plugtop of that calibre may be useful........

 

[sparks72]

I would like to thank everyone for their comments. :wink5:

Can I just say that the main reason I posted this guys shoddy paperwork is to show the level of sub standard workmanship and knowledge in the industry today. how this guy passes an assessment every year beggars belief!, after all it's their own fault if anything goes wrong!

After speaking to the poor clueless letting agent, here's what I suspected and confirmed.
The man who carried out this report is....you guessed it!........a plumber!.........with one of those Part Pee certificate.....errr!......... thingy qualifications.
I did point out that should the insurance company become involved if problems arose then the paperwork would be called into question, I might as well have talked to a cat.

Ok, back to the certificate.

1) No periodic test results available (should have said no test results are available but fair enough)

2) High loop impedance with no RCD protection on some circuits (the non RCD protection is on the lighting circuits, obvious as it's a 10 year old 16th edition installation)

3) Double socket in kitchen isn't earthed (it is now!, loose cable in socket)

4) The installation is wired to an earlier version of regulations (16th).......(Well spotted! It's in the kitchen, the cable going across from one socket to another, the one with the loose earth!, now how did he see that old cable without taking the loose earthed socket off the wall!)

5) The lower floor smoke alarm is not working (that's because it's not attached to the mains!.........it's battery operated, and the battery is dead!!!)

 

[Deleted member 26818]

My local Council leases properties off of private landlords, to rent out for social housing.
They have a check list of things they require before accepting a property.
One of which is a satisfactory electrical safety report, conducted by someone registered with either the NICEIC or NAPIT.
When I queried this, they allowed that it could be someone registered with any of the government approved registration bodies.
Essentially anyone registered with a competent person scheme.
The only form that I have been able to find which is actually refered to as an 'electrical safety report', is the visual condition report offered by the NICEIC.
The council refused to accept my 9 page EICR, with it's pages of inspection schedule, and it's schedule of test results as I'm not registered with anyone.
However it appears they are quite willing to accept a visual, which has a rather poor schedule of inspections and no schedule of test results http://www.niceic.com/Uploads/File2057.pdf.

 

[oldtimer]

Well thanks again for sharing this with us sparks 72 this has been a real school day for me and spinlondon I totally agree with you because this is

what the NICEIC have put at the top of their DVCR document Issued in accordance with British Standard BS 7671 - Requirements for Electrical Installations


I must admit this has thrown me a wobbly as it was drummed into me that its either a EIC, PIR/EICR , MWC and no buts as per the BRB now the BGB now all of a sudden they are now admitting that a EICR is a bit over the top so there you go here is a cut down version ie DVCR. Now I am not wanting to rubbish this off if this is the direction that they have agreed it should go infact I welcome something like this as no landlord or letting agent is going to pay for a full EICR every time there is a change of tenant .

No whats got my goat is the fact that they have stamped their name all over this certificate yet make no mention of it good greif look at the mess of introducing the EICR caused at the same time it looks like local councils are doing deals with NICEIC,NAPIT,ELSCA ect that has undermined what if any faith I had left with these people. In other words the EICR road is not working lets try something else but lets not roll it out as an official move well here is hoping that the NICEIC will answer my is this a legal document under BS7671 question that I asked on the Voltimum Q&A


I forgot to add that when a letting agent g**gles EICR they will get sight of this thread and will start to ask for a DVCR cost