Thoughts on distribution board upgrade

[Gazthesparky]

Got called out to a hairdressers yesterday after they were receiving shocks from a hair straiteners

Got there to find a single phase consumer unit no RCDs in site and no main earth or bonding at all

So remedy that by putting a temp earth rod in and bonding to water and gas

I have said that it requires a distribution board upgrade and RCDs installed on the shower and socket circuits. As the exsisting consumer unit is a mess

There is a 3phase supply and a 3 phase meter so the customer is being charged for the supply.

They have just lifted the brown phase out of the 3phase isolator and fitted a single phase consumer unit.

Should I keep the supply and quote to install a 3phase distribution board and split the circuits over the 3 phases

Or seeing as the customer isn't using the supply tell them and go down the root of getting the meter changed and upgrading the single phase consumer unit

What would you do ??

 

[Gazthesparky]

So you found a damaged flex, due to that you recommended a new DB ? ? ? ?

How long has this place been running with the present set up?

No wonder electricians get a bad reputation.

No now that's not nice and I pride myself on offering a good honest service!!!!!

If you read the post you will see

I got called to look why someone was receiving a shock

I identified it was a faulty appliance if that was the end of it I would of removed it from service and end of.

I then looked and all their items were out of date by 2 years so I suggested they get them pat tested to help manage risks like this.

I wondered why an RCD hadn't tripped so went to look at the consumer unit to find that there was no RCDs on anything looked a bit further and saw no bonding on the water or gas then thought I that's strange I see no main earth connection so decided to open up the consumer unit where a rats nest of wires appeared and there was no main earth in sight.

I installed a rod and main bonding as a temp measure. I meggered the rings to check for faults and recommended they have RCDs on the 2 shower circuits and the 3 socket circuits. I have priced up rcbos for the existing consumer unit and best I can get is 30 quid each so 5x30 is 150 so it's getting expensive to muddle through with the exsisting

They have a 3phase supply and meter and whoever installed it just linked off one phase so I was mearly asking for opinions as to what people thought

A. replace the single phase board keeping it single phase and getting the meter changed

Or

B. keep the 3phase supply and put a nice 3 phase board in splitting the circuits over the 3 phase and installing rcbos on the circuit. This means they are ready to go should they expand and have sun beds for example as it's a hair and beauty salon

I don't see how my advice is going to give electricians or cirtainly me a bad name.

And I'm just at the quoting stage for the moment I just could t decide which route to go down.

 

[Gazthesparky]

Congratulations you have identified a faulty appliance! You may now put a red pat fail sticker on it

Oh and you're paying too much for your RCBOs if they are £30 each, reasonable SPSN RCBOs can be had for £16 each!

I did got my red stickers out the van lol

And I have priced up proteus rcbos from cef at 30 quid each that's the best price I've been quoted when I went in there. I don't hold an account with them so I guess that's why I don't normally pay that for rcbos just the exsisting board is proteus

 

[Engineer54]

I did got my red stickers out the van lol

And I have priced up proteus rcbos from cef at 30 quid each that's the best price I've been quoted when I went in there. I don't hold an account with them so I guess that's why I don't normally pay that for rcbos just the exsisting board is proteus

Well that's another good valid reason to change out the CU!! lol!!

 

[Fox]

Proteus equipment sucks! But I suppose sometimes you've got to play the best game with what you're dealt!

 

[Andy78]

Proteus equipment sucks! But I suppose sometimes you've got to play the best game with what you're dealt!

Proteus ? I fold, deal me again.

 

[trev]

I fold.

As does Proteus gear

 

[Fox]

proteus - prəʊtɪəs - noun 1. a bacterium found in the intestines of animals and in the soil.

Fantastic business model

 

[telectrix]

proteus. n., over priced, under performing , cheap crap. fit a new DB.

 

[atm84]

The earth rod was a temp fix I already had it on the van and it was just easier and quicker to put the rod in. I am going to contact the energy company to check earthing arrangement and get them to provide an earth for the property if there's one available. Didn't think the energy company would come out within the hour to provide an earth point.

Don't want to put a front end RCD in because you won't get discrimination and limitation of loss of supply.

The old board is a mess I could fit 5 rcbos into the board but at 30 quid a pop it seems a expensive bodge

Think I will go down the 3phase dis board route leaves the 3phase supply and split the circuits over the 3 phases

Thanks for the opinions

Sorry I'm confused. Why can't you tell what the existing earthing arrangement is? Surely you can tell by looking at the service head.

Why do you need to find out from the energy supplier if they can provide an earth? Its the DNO, not the energy supplier who provides the earth. Is the existing a TT?

 

[Gazthesparky]

Sorry I'm confused. Why can't you tell what the existing earthing arrangement is? Surely you can tell by looking at the service head.

Why do you need to find out from the energy supplier if they can provide an earth? Its the DNO, not the energy supplier who provides the earth. Is the existing a TT?

Get off your high horse when I say check with the supplier I do mean the DNO just said supplier but I ment that I would contact the people who supply the cable and cut out into the building my mistake saying the wrong word.

And you cannot just assume that the supply has an earth their. There is a newish service head on the supply but no sticker to say it's PME ect. So you have to contact the DNO to confirm that there is a earth available. That's what I was meaning. Once the DNO confirm that there is an earth available on the supply be that TNCS OR TNS I will put in a earth cable from the service head.

There was NO earth rod installed when I arrived I installed one as a temporary measure untill I can confirm either way!!!

 

[Guest77]

Get off your high horse when I say check with the supplier I do mean the DNO just said supplier but I ment that I would contact the people who supply the cable and cut out into the building my mistake saying the wrong word.

And you cannot just assume that the supply has an earth their. There is a newish service head on the supply but no sticker to say it's PME ect. So you have to contact the DNO to confirm that there is a earth available. That's what I was meaning. Once the DNO confirm that there is an earth available on the supply be that TNCS OR TNS I will put in a earth cable from the service head.

There was NO earth rod installed when I arrived I installed one as a temporary measure untill I can confirm either way!!!

That will be difficult for atm, he is a short fella

 

[GMES]

And he hasn't got an horse!

 

[trev]

There is a newish service head on the supply but no sticker to say it's PME ect. So you have to contact the DNO to confirm that there is a earth available.

Erm, no, I disagree. It's fairly easy to confirm that an earth has been provided.

 

[atm84]

There is a newish service head on the supply but no sticker to say it's PME ect. So you have to contact the DNO to confirm that there is a earth available.

Erm, no, I disagree. It's fairly easy to confirm that an earth has been provided.

Yes I agree, its easy to see if there is an earth. Maybe I have a better view though, what with being sat on my high horse.

What Ze reading are you getting?

 

[atm84]

Do you honestly think that until now the building hasn't got an earth??

I mean, you are right never to assume but if you have any doubts then surely you would carry out further investigation before leaving site, to clarify. A simple Ze test would confirm if there is an earth available.