Tier 4

[Midwest]

But there are so many problems with these figures. For example, anyone who was admitted to hospital and tested positive and then died was put down as a covid death - even if they died from a heart attack or injuries sustained in a car accident. And it seems no-one is dying from flu this year. Why is that? Put down as covid deaths, that's why.

Same could be said for any stats; Covid is way above anything we currently had before,

 

[Selfmade]

I think the stats are largely irrelevant, we have a fixed capacity of ICU beds and ICU nurses. It does not matter what illness brings a patient to an ICU bed. Covid means a proportion who catch it need hospital treatment and a smaller proportion need ICU, i don't believe this is a disputed fact.

Once we run out of ICU beds / nurses... whats the plan for those who dont agree with the government's approach ? Just shrug shoulders and let them die ??

I do find this a really strange discussion but i guess everyone is free to give an opinion.

But this ignores all the videos of empty hospitals. And then there are the treatments suppressed to justify the emergency authorisation of a vaccination.

Oh, and it is refreshing to be allowed to give an opinion. In lots of other places doctors and scientists are having posts and videos deleted because the likes of G**gle, F*cebo*k etc., think they know more about health and medicine.

 

[Selfmade]

So, do I listen to the vast majority of medical experts of many different countries, or do I listen to some random people who seem to think they know better for some reason?

Maybe I should start listening to Piers Corbyn and his anti mask protest meetings? Maybe I should listen to a minority of people who seem to think this is all an government plan to control us?

Mmm, let me think.

I did point to a few experts disagreeing with the narrative earlier on. I'm sure there are many more. Who are the experts supporting it? Bill Gates? Neil Fergusson? Even WHO have backflipped and no longer support lockdowns. And what about asking a few economists how many people will die from the economic fallout from the lockdowns?

 

[Midwest]

But there are so many problems with these figures. For example, anyone who was admitted to hospital and tested positive and then died was put down as a covid death - even if they died from a heart attack or injuries sustained in a car accident. And it seems no-one is dying from flu this year. Why is that? Put down as covid deaths, that's why.

I have no reason to doubt that our health care professionals are recording things correctly, and will change recording deaths etc if the needs arise, and appears have done. It’s seems they have checks and balances in place. That said deciding on the cause of deaths, is sometimes not straight forward, depending on the illness of the persons in case.

I‘ve heard of the case of a car accident victims etc, and cause of death recorded as Covid, and other such cases. But where the media simplifies such examples, I suspect it’s more complicated.

Flu deaths 2019 - 20

Behind the headlines

I see no reason to doubt we are in the middle of a serious pandemic, which requires some demanding measures.

 

[UNG]

I did point to a few experts disagreeing with the narrative earlier on. I'm sure there are many more. Who are the experts supporting it? Bill Gates? Neil Fergusson? Even WHO have backflipped and no longer support lockdowns. And what about asking a few economists how many people will die from the economic fallout from the lockdowns?

The Covid argument is similar to what has been seen with climate change in recent years

We seem to have all of a sudden found a lot of experts on both sides operating in this sector and having an understanding of how this virus is spreading and mutating and how it should be tackled, we have also seen how different governments are trying to tackle the spread in different ways. Sweden was hailed as having the best response but even that is now being questioned as they have seen massive spikes in infections in recent weeks. Finding a definitive solution that works is nigh on impossible short of a massive lockdown where nothing moves for a month or more
The problem is that any response seems to be driven and / or tempered by finance / economic issues, WHO are not totally independent and rely on funding from governments so their responses can be influenced

Will we ever know who was right and who was wrong, will we ever return to what we had before is anyone's guess, will the vaccine be the great saviour that most of these experts think it is.

 

[littlespark]

If the vaccine is anything like the flu vaccine, then we may need to get it every year.... then as time passes, they’ll say only elderly or those with a health condition need it.

then again. I’m not a virologist... So I really don’t know if the Covid vaccine works the same as the the flu one.

has any expert tested the flu vaccine to see if it works against Covid in any way?

 

[Strima]

And it's just been announced we go from tier 2 to tier 4 on Boxing day... ?

Getting bored of this now.

 

[Midwest]

We're going into Tier 4 here in Oxfordshire as well on Boxing Day. Would of been a good excuse not to see the mother in law, if she was still alive ? (don't mean that!).

Had my first Covid jab today. Nurse was quite rude; said you'll feel a little ----- (brick spelt with a p. flippin forum censorship).

 

[Baddegg]

I personally didn’t know a single person who’d had a confirmed case until yesterday, I dont believe there’s a one size fits all government conspiracy, very por management and ineptitude from the start without a doubt with anyone in opposition political point scoring and scaremongering within the media (but what’s new there?) but you’d have to be nuts to believe certain individuals in government and big businesses arnt gonna use this situation to they advantage, I forget who said it first so I can’t quote but it is a shame common sense went out the window years ago in this country, and the irresponsible media reporting with glee on people that have found “loop holes” to have get togetherness is wholly irresponsible and reprehensible.....they should be using the position to shame these people.....why would you want to find a bloody loophole to a catching the virus? Regardless of anyone’s views on how easy it is to catch or how dangerous it is to have, facts are it exists......

 

[Baddegg]

And it's just been announced we go from tier 2 to tier 4 on Boxing day... ?

Getting bored of this now.

Ahhhhhh man that’s terrible....at least they had the decency to tier 4 me before Christmas so I got out of seeing the mother in law!.....to do after that is cruel!!

 

[Dustydazzler]

Odds on for the rest of England to be promoted to Tier 4 on new Year eve

 

[Strima]

Ahhhhhh man that’s terrible....at least they had the decency to tier 4 me before Christmas so I got out of seeing the mother in law!.....to do after that is cruel!!

She rocked up today to wish my wife happy birthday but she stayed in the car and made my missus stand in the rain, she's good like that... ?

 

[Zerax]

Just a quick 'bag of a smoke packet' calculation... but according to the NHS, in England we have 0.58 GPs per 1,000 patients... and it's a fair assumption that we have at least this number again of nursing staff (trained to give hypodermic injections) in GP practices... so;

If we want to vaccinate say 50% of the population... being enough to stop the virus propogating and protecting the most likely candidates for severe symptoms (fat and/or already very ill)... each GP/Nurse would need to vaccinate about 500 patients each... at say 5 mins per 'jab' x 2 'jabs' and if they worked 12 hrs per day (it's a pandemic after all) that would take them 500/6[patients per hour]/12[working 12 hrs a day]= 7 days

Assuming we have enough of the vaccine... this lockdown nonsense could be over in a week !!

Clearly I'm missing something with this calculation ??

 

[Zerax]

She rocked up today to wish my wife happy birthday but she stayed in the car and made my missus stand in the rain, she's good like that... ?

Maybe some sort of 'umbrella' would have been in order ?

 

[plugsandsparks]

Dunno, but i will have a go at working it out, i think the 5 mins is a bit optimistic, unless there is a separate admin part so you just pull your pants down and hey presto.