Who's right? Hopefully me!

[Drew34]

Yesterday whilst doing my practical assessment (2365 level 2) I caused a bit of a stink.
I was working on a couple of 2 way switches with singles through pvc conduit.
As the training centre boss walked past he started over me having blue cable at the switches.
He kept saying 'why have you got neutrals?'
My response was ' I haven't. I'm going to sleeve them brown. Surly it's not neutral if it's not doing what a neutral should do it's just a cable until terminated.'
My tutor had no problem with this method.
Maybe I should have just smiled and pleased him.
Was I right?

 

[123]

My old boss did that once. Sorry to say I laughed.

I now have plenty of 3mm bore blue sleeving in stock

 

[Ian1981]

Like I say I use twin brown quite a lot and unless it’s different with various manufacturers, the insulation on the browns is the same no lighter shade etc.
Or maybe I’ve just never noticed?

 

[Ian1981]

My old boss did that once. Sorry to say I laughed.

I refused to 2nd fix a job because of this once.
I was expected to bell out the cores and oversleeve the neutral with blue sleeving.
The numpties(we are from the same company) who 1st fixed it where made to go back and do it when I kicked up a stink.

 

[123]

Like I say I use twin brown quite a lot and unless it’s different with various manufacturers, the insulation on the browns is the same no lighter shade etc.
Or maybe I’ve just never noticed?

Have seen different shades, the white inners and both browns being identical. I don't (intentionally) use it, all wholesalers here stock it though. I prefer Brown & Blue, nice and easy to identify what is what

 

[Des 56]

I am surprised twin brown is sometimes not available in England or even been seen by some,it has been very easy to source in my own experience
Twin & Earth Brown - Brown Cable - https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Main_Index/Cable_Index/Twin_and_Earth_Brown/index.html

 

[Lucien Nunes]

Unless I'm mistaken, in Aus there is a special cable for switch drops with red and white cores. They still use red/black/G+Y so red carries through as the PL and white is the SL. That way you can tell at any fitting which is the switch drop and which of its cores is PL & SL. No sleeving or belling through required. I would have thought brown/black better than brown/brown for our own version.

OTOH in the USA, historically they used normal Black/White/CPC T+E (i.e. Romex / NM)for switch drops but PL and SL were reversed relative to UK practice. White (normally neutral) was sleeved black to make the PL, black (normally hot / line) was the SL. This made the colours at the lamp terminals correct, and the PL of the switch drop immediately identifiable at the loop-through as it is a white sleeved black. Sounds a bit funny when you're used to doing it our way but it makes sense. Since 2011 (?) switch drops are normally 3-core as a neutral is required to be available at switches. As their 3C+E contains black, white and red (second hot / SL) they don't need to sleeve as the colours (sorry, colors) are already right for PL, SL & N.

 

[Grant webber]

Iv wired a kitchen extension in twin brown by mistake, about 30 downlights, i didnt even know it existed until i came to second fix it. Bad day at the office

 

[123]

Iv wired a kitchen extension in twin brown by mistake, about 30 downlights, i didnt even know it existed until i came to second fix it. Bad day at the office

30 Downlights in a Kitchen, wowsers. How big was it for that many downlights?

 

[Grant webber]

Open plan kitchen diner

30 Downlights in a Kitchen, wowsers. How big was it for that many downlights?

A fair size. Loads of big houses round here

 

[Toneyz]

Open plan kitchen diner

A fair size. Loads of big houses round here

When I used to get twin brown delivered used to mark on drum B/B.so could not get mixed up.

 

[Risteard]

I would have thought brown/black better than brown/brown for our own version.

There wouldn't be much sense in that as it would require remarking to comply with BS7671 as the phase must be brown with single phase.

 

[dmxtothemax]

Everyone knows that Brown electricity doesn't travel well in Blue cable ! TSK TSK !

 

[Sparkingmad]

And then you have heating engineers who have been told they can use what ever colours they like inc G/Y as long as they identify it with brown sleeving .
I think the OP has got his answer if he used black instead of blue then nothing would have been said as black is a L conductor whether it’s PL or SL.

 

[Risteard]

I think the OP has got his answer if he used black instead of blue then nothing would have been said as black is a L conductor whether it’s PL or SL.

Not correct. Black is L2 in a three-phase system. Black would have been equally incorrect.

 

[Sparkingmad]

Black is L2 in a 3 ph system but it is also a SwL in single phase. My point is whether it is brown or black in 3ph or single phase in a 3 core + E cable an electrician would expect it to be live or to become live. Where as blue would be expected to be neutral. So even though not technically correct it would have at least been a colour associated with a live conductor?