Borrowed neutral question.

[schoe]

Just out of interest if i was to fit a new dual rcd split board and a came across a borrowed netural on a lighting circuit how could i resolve it?


Thanks Chris

 

[RomRobi]

I am really suprised by some of the threads I've read, and I dont see why a borrowed neutral from 2 lighting circuit should be a big issue. As someone said, why should you ripped the property apart for one friggin neutral. Remember this is a fuse board change, as long as the load is corrected, a warning notice and its recorded, also, yes it can be a danger if this hasn't been adhered to. If borrowing a neutral from the socket for a light then I would have said its a NO NO.

Note: if you decide to run a neutral, never run one on its own, if I'm right as someone suggested.

 

[GLENNSPARK]

I am really suprised by some of the threads I've read, and I dont see why a borrowed neutral from 2 lighting circuit should be a big issue. As someone said, why should you ripped the property apart for one friggin neutral. Remember this is a fuse board change, as long as the load is corrected, a warning notice and its recorded, also, yes it can be a danger if this hasn't been adhered to. If borrowing a neutral from the socket for a light then I would have said its a NO NO.

Note: if you decide to run a neutral, never run one on its own, if I'm right as someone suggested.

521.5.2 (p97)
FERROMAGNETIC ENCLOSURES: ELECTROMAGNETIC EFFECTS
The conductors of an AC circuit installed in a ferromagnetic enclosure shall be so arranged so that all line conductors and the neutral conductor, if any, and the appropriate protective conductor are contained in the same enclosure........

 

[RomRobi]

Thank you Gleenspark, I wish I could afford another regs book. haha.

 

[GLENNSPARK]

Thank you Gleenspark, I wish I could afford another regs book. haha.

No probs mate. Better wait for the first amendment to come out. P.S. I don`t sit here all day with regs book in hand quoting regs n numbers (could anyone be that lonely)?.lol.........

 

[RomRobi]

First amendment my back side. they should have looked well ahead before they leap. why is it so soon very 10- 13yrs when the regs are updated. I think we definetly all know the answer.

 

[GLENNSPARK]

The big R mate (and i aint talking about resistance here either).....revenue £££££££££££££££

 

[Knobhead]

OK, lets assume we’ve resolved the shared neutral problem. I’m going to throw a peble (rock) in the water and see where the ripples finish. You now have in your hallway a switch that has two separate live feeds to it. It should be identified, now do you put a warning lable on it? Mrs. Brown isn’t going to be impressed if you do, it doesn’t match the wallpaper.

Just remember Mrs. Brown has neighbours, her approval could lead to more local work for you. P**s her off and you’ve s**t it!

I’m just glad I’ve only ever done 4 houses in my life, they go me stressed out! Just pass my sledge hammer, I’ll stick to my favourite industrial stuff.

View attachment 7360

 

[oxocube]

You now have in your hallway a switch that has two separate live feeds to it. It should be identified, now do you put a warning lable on it?

Nothing wrong with a switch with two separate lives.
It does not need identifying.
And it does not need a warning label.

The only warning label required at any light switch, including an industrial one, is for the presence of 400v.

 

[Knobhead]

So you isolate the downstairs lights and remove the switch (the switch is downstairs). You then get a belt off the upstairs lights, that’s OK is it?

 

[telectrix]

TBH, as a 2 gang switch in a hall operates on both the downstairs and upstairs circuits, t'would be normal procedure to test for safe isolation before inserting fingers. i personally would make a note in the back box of 2 "live" feeds.

 

[Des 56]

Whilst we are on these issues of domestic warnings :devilish:


What about my warning sticker for the consumer unit kindly constructed by brains-lans
http://www.electriciansforums.net/c...cal/37364-old-colours-again-3.html#post348630

What with one lighting circuit and stickers on the 2-gang and the consumer unit, we will have achieved Nirvana for the householder,where will it end, and why should it

 

[topquark]

TBH, as a 2 gang switch in a hall operates on both the downstairs and upstairs circuits, t'would be normal procedure to test for safe isolation before inserting fingers. i personally would make a note in the back box of 2 "live" feeds.

That was one of the first ever shocks I had about 30 years ago, being a newly formed muppet at the time! :banghead:

 

[Knobhead]

You say in industry it’s not a requirement to draw attention to possible danger, I beg to differ.
Under the EWA it is a mandatory requirement to identify multiple feeds to a panel or switch.
You’d love a system like this. it only shows the interconnects between two 11KV substations, there were 17. Most with 550V, 440V and 220V DC.

View attachment 7361

 

[GLENNSPARK]

You say in industry it’s not a requirement to draw attention to possible danger, I beg to differ.
Under the EWA it is a mandatory requirement to identify multiple feeds to a panel or switch.
You’d love a system like this. it only shows the interconnects between two 11KV substations, there were 17. Most with 550V, 440V and 220V DC.

View attachment 7361

I think they are dropping that on the amendment though tony: warning signs of the presence of 2 different voltages in the same enclosure................

 

[onions1066]

telectrix please put your hand on your heart and say with a straight face you write in the back of a 2 gang switch box, if you dont know there are 2 supplies at the 2 gang switch at the bottom of the stairs you shouldnt be taking the switch off in the first place.