Help! Wiring for 4.3Kw cooker

[Des 56]

There is comment on this subject on these forums but there is arguement for and against

I think you have your wires crossed on the discussions

During an inspection where no grommetts were in place,there was discussion on the coding of the issue
It is at the least very bad practice to not use them, and at best fortunate that there may be no cable damage

The responses may have included thoughts that they are now in situ, and the insertion of gromettes on an in sevice installation may do more harm than leaving it be

Those opinions for a Pir are completely different to willfully using bad practice by not fitting them




Sorry to say,but
I have read through this thread and my impression is that an electrician may not have been involved in this installation at all
I can understand clients wanting opinions on whether dedicated circuits are required etc,but the whole thread has centered around how and what is best to actually carry out an installation that the person is unsure of
In that context I would advise that an electrician is employed to do this work

Its not often that unimformed customers quote regulation numbers to ask for opinions either
I will not post again on this thread

 

[ELEKTRIC]

Newcastle upon Tyne

www.arbusservices.co.uk

 

[malcolmsanford]

All,

Firstly, I'm not any kind of electrician, but I am a customer of a cowboy electrician!!

I have 2.5mm2 cable running around my kitchen and I asked my 'electrician' if this would be ok to wire up a 30Amp 4.3Kw oven (the hob is gas) and he said 'yeah, should be ok'. However, looking on various forums this appears to be inaccurate. I don't want a meltdown or a fire in my new house....can anybody give me some professional advice from a handbook?

Any pro help would be greatly appreciated.

Kind regards
Gregg

And if I take the manufacturers recommendations, what size wiring do I need? 6mm2 or 10mm2?

Also, whilst I'm on...

Under regulation 522.8.1 - 'A wiring system shall be selected and erected to avoid during installation, use or maintenance,
damage to the sheath or insulation of cables and their terminations' - are rubber grommets required for steel back boxes. There is comment on this subject on these forums but there is arguement for and against. Does anyone have a definitive answer, or this just a judgement call? At the moment the sockets aren't plastered in so I can clearly see that the grommets aren't in situ.

Thanks you all for your guidance

Hmmm I think there is a rabbit away here the regs are not exactly bedtime reading for sparks let alone someone that is not electrical

 

[candidcamel]

Hmmm I think there is a rabbit away here the regs are not exactly bedtime reading for sparks let alone someone that is not electrical

I don't know what you're suggesting Malcolm, but I genuinely am a customer and have very little electrical knowledge. The regs are those that I have googled and found references to on other posts in this forum. My concern was initially raised when the builder that I also have working in the house said that without rubber grommets in steel back boxes, a building inspector would condemn the job. At this point I started doing research online. I don't 'know' the regs, but google is a powerful. I actually work in IT....

I'm happy for anyone on this forum in the Newcastle upon Tyne area to come down and give me their professional opinion and quote for the remainder of the job.

PS it doesn't take a genius to notice poor workmanship when the sockets are neither flush nor level, the grommets are missing on some steel backboxes, some backboxes are just hanging loose in a lathe and plaster wall, floorboards are missing, one light only works every fourth time you switch it on and cables are running diagonally up a wall. I'm not even sure this last bit is legal!

 

[candidcamel]

Thanks telectrix - seems like common sense to me, rather than electrical genius. Sadly not for my guy.

Actually, on one socket he did leave a screw out of a socket when using a dry wall back box. When I tried to check this I found that the yellow plastic 'clip' on one side of the bock box was missing and there was no hole & thread to put the screw into!

 

[candidcamel]

One last point....I'm not stupid enough to try and do electrical works to the house I have just bought and risk it burning to the ground! I have have done NO electrical work on the house and contracted it out to one guy who is a friend of a friend and is listed on the NICEIC website.
I'm sure you're shocked (and perhaps disbeliving) that a NICEIC electrician would do such poor quality work - I'm sure you guys wouldn't - that's because you're professionals.

I respect all your opinions and appreciate your sound advice

Many thanks

 

[malcolmsanford]

I'm then profoundly sorry for questioning your post. It is not unheard of, espicially as this time of year, for troll's to post spurious threads to get us old crotchity electricians at it!

As the other guys have said if he is indeed NICEIC, which I doubt he is, then they are duty bound to sort this out, and will advise you what to do. I think your only way forward is to contact another electrcian, though as it is 3 days before christmas you might not be too successful, but it's worth a shout

 

[BluSparx]

Hi Candid

I am down in Teesside, so not too far although normally outside of my working area, if you are struggling to get somebody to come and have a look let me know and I will PM you a Price for coming to look at the job for you and provide a written report if needed on what my opinion on the work is for you to forward to NICEIC as part of your complaint regarding the guy you used - that is if he is registered at all as like others on this forum I believe this guy isn't registered and low and behold the NICEIC will hopefully come down on him like a ton of bricks

 

[ELEKTRIC]

I could come and have a look at it tomorrow

Arbus Services

 

[candidcamel]

Blusparx / Arbus,

Thanks for offering to help out.

The electrician that the builder usually uses is coming to see me tomorrow evening. If I need a second opinion or a second quote I'll be in touch via your websites.

Cheers

 

[i=p/u]

but if you can get away with 2.5 Cable, do it, then come back when they buy bigger cooker, win win

 

[candidcamel]

Hmmn, thanks for that insight. I AM the customer, so not Win/Win exactly.

It's this kind of nonsense which I don't appreciate. Why not just do it right in the first place?

 

[Deleted member 26818]

It is generally accepted that grommits can be omitted where there is no chance of movement of the cables. For instance where the cables a plasterd in walls.
However some are of the opinion that even then, vibration due to heavy traffic can cause the cables to rub against the sharp edges of the back box.

 

[candidcamel]

FYI the sockets and back boxes have just been put in and are not plastered in yet, but will be soon.

Could it be argued that putting in and pulling out plugs could cause the cables to rub against the sharp edges of the back box and sever into the cable?

I know earlier I quoted regulation 522.8.1 'A wiring system shall be selected and erected to avoid during installation, use or maintenance, damage to the sheath or insulation of cables and their terminations'

Does this mean that on my rewiring job where steel back boxes have been put in where there previously weren't any there, that the electrician should definitely have used rubber grommets in these back boxes?

 

[telectrix]

should always use grommets wherever cable passes through metal holes. only exception is where the cable entry is flared, as in most plaster depth lighting boxes.