In defence of the short course trainee

[JD6400]

How do the Electrical Trainee’s get insurance? Any company with an ounce of sense wouldn’t touch them with a barge pole.

They don't need to lose much sleep on this one as the scheme providers have cottoned on to yet another revenue stream and are offering this to members as part of their portfolio that has f""k all to do with the original safety aspect that they were all set up for in the first place!!!

We have just jumped through the hopes again just before Christmas , for the limited domestic work that we carry out , and i got the impression that we really should be using their in house insurance as opposed to the long established , and industry respected NFU who we currently use ?

 

[Specialist]

So a lot like a Electrical Trainee wonder then ..............stop it malc anyone seen my pills?

Will you behave:lol:

 

[malcolmsanford]

Will you behave:lol:

sorreeeeeeee Andy:flowers:

 

[Specialist]

By outsider I meant I don't live or work in the UK and I have very little grasp of the system of qualifications there.

Hi Marvo: Just wondering how things work over in South Africa ? Do they still have a proper training program ? or are things going the same way as over here.

 

[Specialist]

sorreeeeeeee Andy:flowers:

Morning mate, you'll be getting as Sarky & Cynical as me before long
:biggrin: Talking of pills, I aint taken mine yet.

 

[Stevi3]

It took me 5 years to qualify as an electrician as when I left school I had no qualifications(due to my own misbehaving) but because of that I then had to spent an extra year to get a diploma in electronics and engineering which was a bridging course to get into the electrical one, but my point is that it really gets under my skin as to think that people can more or less get to this stage through a 5 week course,

The company I done my apprenticeship with would never have done any domestic work therefore my only experience in houses is through that first year in tech 6 years ago apart form some homers that I would have done. (light fittings, showers, extra sockets) I am now qualified about 2 years, having only worked about 10/12 months from qualifying, about a month ago a friends uncle asked me would I rewire his house as its being renovated. Through mostly lack of confidence and experience in houses I declined to do the work for him. What I dont understand is how can someone after only a 5 week course go and undertake work like this when through a course like that they wouldn't even be scratching the surface of what would be involved in our trade.

 

[UNG]

This is a subject that will rattle on and on and is nothing new with the electrical industry

The quick training system is nothing new those of us old enough to remember the skill centre 3 month sparks of the late 70's and early eighties and the moans of having them on a site and carrying them because of the lack of knowledge and experience while getting the same rate of pay. The difference now is the time scale is 5 weeks.

How much further they can reduce training times has yet to be seen I wonder when there will be a new edition to the series of "Dummies" books Electrical installation for Dummies!!

As I have previously said in other threads these courses are being mis-sold and promising things that are not being achieved, the salesmans pitch of this dream of 50k a year after 5 weeks is all to enticing to some and clouds the judgement. If it's too good to be true then it is is forgotten.
And the issue of "licence" to work by the scheme providers on the strength of a short course qualification without demonstrating reasonable experience has to be aiding and abetting and endorsing the 5 week system. If the internet ceased to exist how would the Electrical Trainee course continue to exist with no where for those problem questions to be asked

The CITO electrical course for caravan engineers is another example of short course training that doesn't work it lasts 2 days and aims to make them competent to produce PIR's for caravan electrics with little or no knowledge before attending

To take something from a comment made earlier does any one know of any forums for brain surgeons as I'm thinking of retraining and would like some advice as the number of head cases in the world is on the up so there must be an opportunity

It is unfortunate that there are not that many companies that can offer the chance to newly trained operatives to gain experience in all aspects of electrical work to produce well round electricians these days but it all goes along with the decline in standards that has been happening unchecked for years

Comments where made on this forum about protecting the term "Engineer" may be the term "Qualified Electrician" should be protected and used by those who have the breath of experience and knowledge to underpin the term.

 

[GLENNSPARK]

This is a subject that will rattle on and on and is nothing new with the electrical industry

The quick training system is nothing new those of us old enough to remember the skill centre 3 month sparks of the late 70's and early eighties and the moans of having them on a site and carrying them because of the lack of knowledge and experience while getting the same rate of pay. The difference now is the time scale is 5 weeks.

How much further they can reduce training times has yet to be seen I wonder when there will be a new edition to the series of "Dummies" books Electrical installation for Dummies!!

As I have previously said in other threads these courses are being mis-sold and promising things that are not being achieved, the salesmans pitch of this dream of 50k a year after 5 weeks is all to enticing to some and clouds the judgement. If it's too good to be true then it is is forgotten.
And the issue of "licence" to work by the scheme providers on the strength of a short course qualification without demonstrating reasonable experience has to be aiding and abetting and endorsing the 5 week system. If the internet ceased to exist how would the Electrical Trainee course continue to exist with no where for those problem questions to be asked

The CITO electrical course for caravan engineers is another example of short course training that doesn't work it lasts 2 days and aims to make them competent to produce PIR's for caravan electrics with little or no knowledge before attending

To take something from a comment made earlier does any one know of any forums for brain surgeons as I'm thinking of retraining and would like some advice as the number of head cases in the world is on the up so there must be an opportunity

It is unfortunate that there are not that many companies that can offer the chance to newly trained operatives to gain experience in all aspects of electrical work to produce well round electricians these days but it all goes along with the decline in standards that has been happening unchecked for years

Comments where made on this forum about protecting the term "Engineer" may be the term "Qualified Electrician" should be protected and used by those who have the breath of experience and knowledge to underpin the term.

Depends...if were talking about "PAT testing engineer"<<<<<whatever the hell that is.....

 

[Specialist]

PAT Testing Engineer: Someone who's paper qualified to test portable appliances but not nescessarily with any understanding of the appliances they test or how to repair any faults they find or even how to change the fuse in the plug.
Just been through this with a local firm, 1 guy did a pat test on 42 appliances & was back out the door in 65 minutes. When the boss came back off holiday he see's all these pass stickers even on appliances without plugs on & smells a rat. He's talking about taking the guy to court to get his money back.

 

[kung]

I think it would be better to have a domestic installers forum ! I have respect for anyone who learns the right way and people who pay out of their own pocket as the domestic installer by the time their scheme members have spent what is a lot of money getting started etc the gripe is with me is someone arguing with me on how to do a job ! and we have had a cpl on here ! i know theres good and bad in sparks as well as domestic installers and i dont offend any unless called for. I think after doing a domestic installers scheme assessment i was very supprised on how easy it was but i suppose after years in the game and Ind/Com installs that can be more complex if i failed an assessment id give the game up and be a plummer ! As i said i have no problem with anyone only cowboys and people doing dangerous installs !
Good luck.

 

[kung]

To take something from a comment made earlier does any one know of any forums for brain surgeons as I'm thinking of retraining and would like some advice as the number of head cases in the world is on the up so there must be an opportunity

Dont know about that but there is a thread kicking about where there was a bit on the tv where nannys can earn about £65k !

 

[trev]

How do the Electrical Trainee’s get insurance? Any company with an ounce of sense wouldn’t touch them with a barge pole.

They take them because they can pay mate. I'm guessing there'll be a shedload of exclusion clauses in the small print which will allow them not to pay out in the event of a claim

 

[GLENNSPARK]

same with me Kung......the problem i have with these "courses".....is the shallow and narrow content of em.......as a result you get em coming in here and asking about stuff they should know....such as disconnection times, diversity and what size cable/s to use etc.....no good installing if you cant get your head around the basics.....

 

[GLENNSPARK]

i might also like to add that i dont have any issues with anyone trying to better themaelves.....its the 5 week courses and the content of em.....and the companies/organisations behind em......promising 50K plus a year and all that nonsense......

 

[DNS1]

As I've already said, I'm doing a "quick" course, because I have no other option.

What really annoys me is the way that certain "training providers" take the hard sell approach and spout all this b*ll*cks about being fully qualified in 5 weeks, in order to justify their outrageous fees.

After talking to a couple of such providers I admit I was very tempted, but thanks to warnings on here I didn't sign up.

Instead I kept looking, checked out some reviews and made the decision to go with a local provider which charges a third of what others do and told me straight away that once I'd finished I'd be an inexperienced domestic installer only. These guys listened to me, heard what experience I had, heard what I wanted out of the course and advised me accordingly.

The problem doesn't lie with reputable training centres, or the individuals, it lies with the firms who grab the money in return for a load of false promises.