Loop in at ceiling rose or switch?

[sivoodoo]

Which method would you think uses the least amont of cable, looping in at the ceiling rose or at the switch?

Regards

Si.

 

[VoltzElectrical]

cheers then '54. Sometimes, the 'agree to disagree is the best approach and I salute your steadfast approach. Im sure I would learn a lot from you on a job (seriously now, no tongue in cheek). It's a diverse world out there and as long as we're not working dangerously then there is no harm done accepting different working practices. The only harm done is when people can't accept (for no good reason i.e. a regulatory stipulation) that other working practices exist and stick dogmatically to their own ways when other ways could be better and won't open their minds to learning from other people.

Your contributions are thoughtful, respectful, and are borne in mind. i may need you sometime for further enlightenment.

Until then, goodnight and godbless.

regards.

 

[Engineer54]

Is there any such endorsement for the looping at light method?

Tin hat on

Pick up any publication of any merit, such as the various electrician guides and installation practices that are available, discussing or showing lighting circuits diagrams.

 

[D Skelton]

I would say that they are mere examples or diagrams, not endorsements.

For the record, I don't loop at switches, I'm just playing devils advocate.

 

[Engineer54]

I would say that they are mere examples or diagrams, not endorsements.

For the record, I don't loop at switches, I'm just playing devils advocate.

Your probably right, but at least they never use (as far as i have seen) switch looping in their examples!! lol!! Which could in a weird way, be seen as a form of endorsing a particular method over another. ...lol!!!!

 

[ian.settle1]

"There goes yet another nail into the coffin of our industry!! "

Not really.

Its safer, fact.

Most electrocutions occur when a DIYer switches off the switch and removes his ceiling rose believing it is dead "but I switched it off!" he says. Zap.

Its so much more logical to have the neutral at the switch. Turn of the switch and the light is dead, unless of course the missus comes in a switches it back on.

I think my first question is a bit daft anyway. It would all depend on the circuit arangements, I was just wondering and thought there may be a magical equation

Regards

Si

Just go's to show that they are not competant to do electrical work.

 

[Risteard]

I'll see if I can find the IET notes for the pre- AM2 with diagram. off to walk the dog now though.

Cheers.

I presume you're referring to the NET (National Electrotechnical Training). Unless I'm missing something I can't see the connection between the IEE and the AM2.

 

[Octopus]

51 entries - wow.

Either way, IMHO, is appropriate - it generally depends on the design of the house, circuit, etc

Personally I perfer hiding JB's under yards of insulation material along with GU10 down lights, omitting identifying the switch cables properly, ignoring IP rating rules in bathrooms, etc, etc.


JOKING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Lucas]

I genuinly can't see the advantage of Looping at the rose instead of the switch. Looping at the rose mean's you're spending more time working overhead and at a difficult angle which nobody like's doing.

Looping at the switch is miles better IMHO, if you've got a fault its at a comfortable height and if you ever have to add an outside light just a single cable chase up above the switch and you're there. You don't have to worry about get multiple cables to the light. Also, how many times in a loft are the door's relativly close to the loft hatch? Switche's are generally next to the door. Mean's you only have to worry about getting one cable out to the centre of each room which can be a complete pain in a small loft when you have to get two cable's out to the rose and it save's time, you're in the loft shorter because everything is close to the entry hatch. Started rambling at the end but it makes sense to me lol.

 

[llywelyn111]

I loop in at either switch or fitting, all depends on what is easier for the type of lights that are being installed. When downlights or doing outside lights are installed I always loop in at the switch.

 

[VoltzElectrical]

I presume you're referring to the NET (National Electrotechnical Training). Unless I'm missing something I can't see the connection between the IEE and the AM2.

yes. NET, not IEE. My mistake there. still. it's a National endorsement for the method.

 

[VoltzElectrical]

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[GLENNSPARK]

I would have thought either method is acceptable as both employ barriers and enclosures as a means of basic protection.....

 

[cjp1]

I would have thought either method is acceptable as both employ barriers and enclosures as a means of basic protection.....

agreed I use what ever method is best suited to what is being installed .

 

[GLENNSPARK]

agreed I use what ever method is best suited to what is being installed .

And...in the case of a new install (17th)....additional protection by RCD........

 

[Deleted member 9648]

What electronic devices, and would you need a neutral at every switch in the installation?? I think not to be honest!! I don't have anything against having a neutral at the switch position, but ONLY when a neutral is needed. I would never and have never looped through switches as a matter of course. To-date, i have never seen any official body either showing wiring diagrams or describing switch looped lighting circuits or in any other way endorsing such a wiring scheme.

If you take that line Eng54 lighting using T/E cable would be impossible other than using joint boxes. Neutrals at switches not allowed because they are not required?...Well permanant lives are not required at a light,so presumably you do not approve of looping in at lights either?...which leaves only the JB method.

The fact is neutrals used to be frowned on at switches....but nobody has ever been able to give a reason why. For that reason common sense has prevailed and neutrals at switches are just as valid as any other method.