Part P & the 17th Edition.

[professional]

No disrespect to other trades meant here,BUT,we are probably the most certificated trade out there, you have to have this you have to have that,part p,city&guilds,nvq's,17th edition,2391 etc etc etc.Where does it end..!! we seem to bear the brunt of a complete bunch of ----ers sat at desks with nothing better to do (and who probably have no electrical qualifications or experience of the real world) Make it illegal to buy anything from the likes of b&q apart from a plug top fuse...!!! and leave the real work to the professionals such as ourselves. Paper chasing a...holes the lot of them. Rant over,pressure released..!!

Apart from the 17th Ed regs, you don`t need ANY of the rest .........

 

[Farverfred]

Does this mean that Electricians will now have to take a "revised 17th edition course.
When will people realise that the various 16th and 17th edition courses do not teach theory and practice (I had plumbers on my 16th course) they teach how to extract information from BS7671 and if you have passed the 16th there is no reason to take the 17th or any further updated courses unless BS7671 undergoes a substantial change in format as from the 15th to the 16th.
I am getting tired of seeing advertisements " 16th Electricians Reqd." and now "17th Edition Electrician Reqd." and next "17th Edition (Updated) Electricians Reqd."
As for part P, in all my 40 years as a sparks I have never heard a better joke.
Cheers (a disgruntled FarverFred)

 

[RexT]

Hi Farverfred,

I think the most worrying thing is that the lack of awareness by the customer as to the real meanings of the BS7671 standard and I agree with you that the courses are designed to teach how to retrieve (and possibly interpret the information) from the standard. This is similar to a lot of standards in being at the moment.

Better policing is required but in truth there is too much cross trades involved and a lot of people seem only to be interested in price.

Hopefully things may change,

Best wishes,

Rex

 

[LD Electrical]

Apart from the 17th Ed regs, you don`t need ANY of the rest .........

the 17th edition qual is basically used to prove you can NAVIGATE your way through BS7671, it does not give you the practical or theoretical skills to enable you to be a qualified spark.You suggest its ALL you need.Ask yourself this - would you be prepared to let some numpty whos been on the dole for ten years or been shelf stacking all their working life (no disrespect intended to these people) to go on a 3 day course to get their 17th edition,then let them come into your house or workplace and do a rewire just because of this.Me thinks not ...!!!!

 

[Farverfred]

Hello LD Electrical, if you are replying to my post, I think you might have got the wrong end of the stick. When I say that the 16th is all that is required, unless another change in format occurs, I was referring to fully qualified Electricians.
I agree that no sane person would expect anyone who had completed a 3 day course with no prior qualifications and experience to come anywhere near an electrical installation. In my darkest nightmare I would not suggest it.
Cheers, FarverFred.

 

[LD Electrical]

Hello Farverfred , i was replying to the post by "professional" cheers LD

 

[vectraj]

im all for a corgi type system for electricians it needs sorting out,the labc dont care one bit at the mo about work being done they're all broke and crying about the cuts. we want regs that matter but dont cast the earth or your just asking for people to keep going down the cowboy road.

 

[ElectricMick]

Hi all,
I've been out of the loop far a while - primarily because of the attitude of my LABC and the DEMANDS that I pay my hard earned cash to one of the "Professional bodies"!! I went off to the Middle East to work, and very pleasant it was too. I'm back now and considering picking up my tools in the UK again, in the hope that some of the regs had been relaxed because they're more trouble than they're worth!!! For the record, I'm 2381/2 (17th Ed) qualified, 2391 (they don't give that way easily!!) and all the 2377 PAT stuff - and even paid to do one of those Part "P" domestic installer courses in the days before we were forced into joining a scheme just to work normally (because I was told it would suffice and wouldn't need to register as I had proved my competence). I got fed up with paying the LABC £120 to have my work inspected (sometimes, if they bothered to turn up) by a non electrically qualified bloke. Part P has not stopped the cowboys. Why will they just not let qualified electricians get on with the job? If you aren't qualified and get caught then thats your problem, cowboys will always take the chance regardless. Disqualified drivers still drive, and get caught - so it will be with unqualified tradesmen. Why won't they let us do our job and face the consequences of our own actions? I was 30 years in the RAF before coming back into the real world, and have been horrified at how much control the state tries to keep.

 

[sliemasteve]

Regarding electricmick's comment;
I got fed up with paying the LABC £120 to have my work inspected (sometimes, if they bothered to turn up) by a non electrically qualified bloke.

Is this correct that a person without an electric qualification checks an installation on behalf of the local authority?

 

[sparks72]

Regarding electricmick's comment;
I got fed up with paying the LABC £120 to have my work inspected (sometimes, if they bothered to turn up) by a non electrically qualified bloke.

Is this correct that a person without an electric qualification checks an installation on behalf of the local authority?

From what I've seen lately LABC couldn't care less & don't know what the results on a cert mean as long as they get a cert, if you have someone unqualified from the council coming to inspect electrical work then thats a joke, I've never experienced this myself, what I have experienced is the LABC lack of knowledge in the 'definitions' of Part P.
I still think Part P is a tax to stop cash in hand jobs, again from what I've seen Part P has failed miserably, it won't be scrapped because middlemen & the council are making a fortune off your back.

 

[Graeme Harrold]

OK just had to do some digging through the Part P document and it seems to be a little out of date as it refers to complying with BS7671:2001................. And this was just downloaded from the planning portal!!!

 

[Deleted member 19807]

Have a look at page 7 of this document, pages are not numbered so you will have to count from page 1.

http://communities.gov.uk/documents/planningandbuilding/pdf/brac07p20.pdf

look at part P

Things may get worse

 

[sparks1974]

can anyone enlighten me bout what the new part L regs are gonna cover , heard thats the new hoop us sparks are gonna have to jump through

 

[sparks1974]

until bs7671 is statutory law , any man and his dog can carry out instalation work , our only foothold as qualified tradesmen is the electricity at work regs 1989 , i just hope the proposed law going through parliment that every home needs a full test and inspect cert for electrical safety , before they get home insurance

 

[andyb]

until bs7671 is statutory law , any man and his dog can carry out instalation work , our only foothold as qualified tradesmen is the electricity at work regs 1989 , i just hope the proposed law going through parliment that every home needs a full test and inspect cert for electrical safety , before they get home insurance

Not strictly true Sparks1974, The building regs are statutory and part p advocates bs7671. So if not 7671 what standard does the man and his dog work to?