What EICR code for plastic trunking in escape routes?

[KevinH]

Hi to all. I'm new and this is my first post.
I'm doing an EICR on a 3 story building split into multiple offices to let.
One thing I noticed is t+e cables in plastic trunking almost throughout (switch/socket drops, across ceilings to lights etc).
Would this be a code 2 or 3? Also would same code be throughout or just in escape routes?
I understand it could potentially be dangerous (causing entanglement when melting/falling etc), but surely an EICR is regarding electrical safety and as far as I can see the installation is electrically safe!
Any views as it would be a massive job to correct.
Surely if its a C2 then most commercial buildings in the country would fail?
Should I just C3 it and suggest landlord gets a fire safety report done?

 

[Ian1981]

You are inspecting and testing an electrical installation to the current addition of bs 7671 and as such you are checking compliance with regulation 521.11.201 so a code needs applying to this regulation if found non compliant and is a safety concern.

I have applied a C2 to this in the past regarding numerous LV and ELV cables installed above suspended ceilings in escape routes where the cables where mearly supported by twin and earth loops screwed to the existing ceiling, some just screwed into the plasterboard.
If all that lot had come down then yes it’s potentially dangerous in my opinion.
If it’s just the odd piece of trunking without metallic or non combustible supports for the wiring then a C3 at the most if found in escape routes.

 

[Strima]

No code for the plastic trunking. However a definate C3 for cables likely to suffer premature collapse in the event of a fire.

 

[Ian1981]

It will be interesting to see how this is coded when all wiring in an installation requires protection against premature collapse in a fire and the words escape route is removed, Christ make up your minds!

 

[KevinH]

No cables are exposed as all are contained within trunking throughout the installation.
So you guys are saying I give it a C3 ? Im assuming that just applies to the escape routes (stairwells/corridoors etc) as per 521.11.201 and no coding for trunking across ceilings in all rooms.

 

[Adam W]

According to my boss, who's really clued up on things like this, it's a C2 because the cables aren't supported by fire resistant fixings; following the normal thought process it would be a C3, ie it used to comply but doesn't any more, but apparently this is an exception because firefighters have died due to it.

Does it have to be a massive job to correct or could you put stainless steel cable ties and bases inside the plastic trunking?

 

[Octopus]

Another resounding success for the ambiguity of our regs .....

C3

 

[Ian1981]

To be honest all the guidance written by the so called experts (NICEIC, best practice guide and I’ve read Napits code breakers guide) all do suggest a C2.
Me if it’s a high concentration of cables at risk of collapse then I C2 it.
A picece of yt2 in an escape route with say a twin and earth cable in it on its own C3 as I believe the risk is severely reduced.
As the inspector it lies with you.

 

[KevinH]

Thanks guys. Think I will take Ians advice and C2 the 'bulky' concentrations and C3 the odd little ones.
Then if Landlord agrees (and pays) I will secure the worst with stainless ties and bases inside the trunking as Adam suggests.
Cheers!

 

[Octopus]

Thanks guys. Think I will take Ians advice and C2 the 'bulky' concentrations and C3 the odd little ones.
Then if Landlord agrees (and pays) I will secure the worst with stainless ties and bases inside the trunking as Adam suggests.
Cheers!

It’s irrelevent what the landlord thinks..... you are doing an EICR and any remedial work is up to them ........ the landlord is under no obligation to get anything done.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Problem with this new requirement, is that the danger existed before the Regulation was introduced.
It now not only presents a danger but is also a non-compliance.

 

[magnoliafan89]

We were once told to fall withing fire regs the cable within the trunking had to be supported with something such as a butterfly clip every 300 or 900mm i cant remember what distance now. Is this correct?

 

[Adam W]

Problem with this new requirement, is that the danger existed before the Regulation was introduced.
It now not only presents a danger but is also a non-compliance.

Surely you could say that about any changes to the regs?
For example previously RCD protection could be omitted if the installation was under the supervision of a skilled or instructed person, but since that was abused and disallowed the same circuit which previously didn't require RCD protection would now not be compliant.

The requirement for fire resistant supports doesn't have to be expensive or intrusive, as I mentioned earlier it could simply involve taking out a few screws and adding metal cable tie bases and cable ties. It doesn't even have to be all the way along, just every metre or so to keep the cables out of the way in the event of a fire.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

There’s never been an exception to omit RCD protection to circuits.
My point is, that having cables anywhere (not just escape routes) which can fall down and entangle fire fighters has always been a dangerous situation warranting a code C2.
Just because there is now a specific requirement does not mean it should only warrant a code C3.

 

[Adam W]

There’s never been an exception to omit RCD protection to circuits.

That was just the first example I could think of, but there has - as I said if the installation was under the supervision of skilled and instructed operatives, dedicated circuits for specific items of equipment, if a risk assessment was attached to the certificate, there may have been others.
It seems the 18th edition is largely about removing these 'loopholes'.