NICEIC Certification Scheme 2391 V NICEIC - Whats the point in 2391??

[ipf]

Bonjour Messier, quelle heure est-il? Ou sont les toilettes?

Got a Grade 3 for that!

Allo, allo....J'oublie. Je ne comprends pas, tres bien. Avez vous une cuppa?
Got a brew for that.

 

[Midwest]

Allo, allo....J'oublie. Je ne comprends pas, tres bien. Avez vous une cuppa?
Got a brew for that.

I only got the GCE, not the O-Level

 

[Leesparkykent]

Calm down.....put you handbags away all joking aside I've deleted a few posts....chill out a bit everyone

 

[Steve Bramah]

If I understand correctly, to do electrical work in accord with BS7671 one needs to be competent. So the qualification is "competence". What is competence, I hear you ask? Being assessed and accepted by a Competent Persons Scheme is one measure perhaps ( ). I can't speak for the Nice Guys, but with my mob they judge competence for EICR is shown when you have practical evidences and a training qualification (2391 for example).

Hi you are correct, so our friend has been mis-informed. You cannot sign off work unless you are a member of any of the schemes mentioned, but you cannot be a "qualifying officer" unless you hold BS2391 or the easier cheapo version of 2394 and 2395. C & G introduced the latter qualifications, because 2391 was too dificult to pass. What does that say for 2394 + 5 holders?

 

[Steve Bramah]

Another point that i am going to raise about filling in an EICR or completion certificate. Without doing the course, 2391 or whatever, I seriously doubt that Joe Average spark would get past the first, of 7, pages.

 

[westward10]

I am a QS but do not hold the 2391.

 

[Steve Bramah]

You CAN issue a certificate for your work with or without testing and inspection quals, and with or without scheme membership. Like I said it's notifying work that is made easier with scheme membership.

Hi Andy, you may be able blag your way through filling in a certificate, but without scheme membership, or qualification, no-one will accept it . Building control aren't going to accept a cert from a non qualified person, and insurance companies will just send it back without a scheme membership number.

 

[Dillb]

Hi Andy, you may be able blag your way through filling in a certificate, but without scheme membership, or qualification, no-one will accept it . Building control aren't going to accept a cert from a non qualified person, and insurance companies will just send it back without a scheme membership number.

Really? Any evidence of this? Or is it well they will try anything to get out getting things done mentality?

 

[Andy78]

Hi Andy, you may be able blag your way through filling in a certificate, but without scheme membership, or qualification, no-one will accept it . Building control aren't going to accept a cert from a non qualified person, and insurance companies will just send it back without a scheme membership number.

I was talking about filling in a certificate to BS7671. This has nothing to do with building control or insurance companies. Anyone who has done a proper electrical training should possess the competence to be able to test and cert their own work. Extra quals for testing and inspection are not necessary.

 

[Steve Bramah]

I am a QS but do not hold the 2391.

If you are a "qualifying supervisor" signing off certificates, but you aren't qualified to fill in the certificate, how does that work?

 

[Ian1981]

If you are a "qualifying supervisor" signing off certificates, but you aren't qualified to fill in the certificate, how does that work?

You need to be competent only.
You do not need a qualification to fill out and certify an installation in the context you speak of.
I have done the inspection and testing course only because my company requested or insisted I have it tho before doing it I had installed and tested for years
By obtaining the qualification I was able to achieve Approved Electricians status but it’s not relevant to every individual who completes certificates.

 

[Dillb]

If you are a "qualifying supervisor" signing off certificates, but you aren't qualified to fill in the certificate, how does that work?

I bet you think HSE won’t allow you work on ladders too don’t you?

 

[Steve Bramah]

I was talking about filling in a certificate to BS7671. This has nothing to do with building control or insurance companies. Anyone who has done a proper electrical training should possess the competence to be able to test and cert their own work. Extra quals for testing and inspection are not necessary.

Hi Andy, so what you are saying, is that because you are a qualified electrician, you are automatically entitled to fill in a cert to cover the work you have undertaken. Why do you think that BS2391 was introduced? Its a level above 1st and 2nd fix installation. To gain 2391, you need to be able to understand the readings that your test equipment has just given you. You need to be able to correlate the readings, to what might be expected. I'm not trying to decry people from thinking that sparks should be confident in what they have installed, but 2391 gives you lots of mathematical equasions that can qualify your readings. Its not that simple. Thats why 2391 exists!

 

[Steve Bramah]

I bet you think HSE won’t allow you work on ladders too don’t you?

I juggle 3 cordless drills whilst hanging on to a 2 metre wooden trestle. lol

 

[Deleted member 26818]

The 2391 qualification was introduced (as I have already pointed out) at the behest of the NICEIC as a requirement for the role of QS.
As for signing off their own work.
Any electrician working in accordance with BS7671 (regardless of qualifications), must be able to sign off their work.