Why do no employers pay the rate any more?

Hardwired · Feb 21, 2015

I don't know if this is just a Scotland specific problem but all the big domestic electrical firms either pay you below the SJIB rate or you work on a price system which amounts in some cases to you doing a full weeks work for £250. It's doing my head in and I'm thinking of quitting the trade. All the companies I have worked for in the last few years are vastly under paying their staff while putting massive amounts of pressure for results. Rant over. But my question is how can they be getting away with this?

Leesparkykent · Feb 21, 2015

Dillb said:
Yes really!!!

How many customers ask for either of these when looking for a electrician?

The OP again;

I don't know if this is just a Scotland specific problem but all the big domestic electrical firms either pay you below the SJIB rate or you work on a price system which amounts in some cases to you doing a full weeks work for £250. It's doing my head in and I'm thinking of quitting the trade. All the companies I have worked for in the last few years are vastly under paying their staff while putting massive amounts of pressure for results. Rant over. But my question is how can they be getting away with this?

I should hope that they are asking to see qualifications! And IMO having a JIB card is beneficial as most sites where big domestic electrical firms tend to work wont let you on without one.

ian.settle1 · Feb 21, 2015

Engineer54 said:
Anyone that remotely thinks that the 17 day and Electrical Trainee influx into the domestic and small commercial sectors don't have an affect on salaries, wages and hourly rates can only be described as being at best ''Naive''!! It's time to wake up, so you can see the wood through the tree's!!

No not Naive you really mean BRAIN DEAD

ian.settle1 · Feb 21, 2015

Leesparkykent said:
The OP again;

I don't know if this is just a Scotland specific problem but all the big domestic electrical firms either pay you below the SJIB rate or you work on a price system which amounts in some cases to you doing a full weeks work for £250. It's doing my head in and I'm thinking of quitting the trade. All the companies I have worked for in the last few years are vastly under paying their staff while putting massive amounts of pressure for results. Rant over. But my question is how can they be getting away with this?

I should hope that they are asking to see qualifications! And IMO having a JIB card is beneficial as most sites where big domestic electrical firms tend to work wont let you on without one.

It is not the JIB card that they will not let you on without but the part that is the ECS part their after.

Engineer54 · Feb 21, 2015

ian.settle1 said:
No not Naive you really mean BRAIN DEAD

ha,ha!! ....I did say ''At Best'' Naive!!

Octopus · Feb 21, 2015

To quote Gordon Brown - "we are importing deflation" which was his was of saying that if we get additional, cheaper labour, into the UK, costs will fall (i.e. salaries)

Leesparkykent · Feb 21, 2015

ian.settle1 said:
It is not the JIB card that they will not let you on without but the part that is the ECS part their after.

And who supply's you with a CSCS ECS card?

Engineer54 · Feb 21, 2015

Murdoch said:
To quote Gordon Brown - "we are importing deflation" which was his was of saying that if we get additional, cheaper labour, into the UK, costs will fall (i.e. salaries)

And long before that, while your goddess Maggie was effectively dismantling British industry and the apprentice system, countries like Germany, Netherlands Belgium etc, etc, were and still are actively promoting and funding them!!

Try again, ...lol!!

baldsparkies · Feb 21, 2015

And I remember with regret, how one Mr Scargill, with probably genuinely good intentions.
played straight into Maggie and the media's hands.
Turning the general public against Unions in favour of a management led power struggle.
The result is a loss of status quo, that's taking us back to the Victorian era.
Without an equal power status between worker and management !!
Well its all part of the problem !!

Octopus · Feb 21, 2015

Engineer54 said:
And long before that, while not my goddess Maggie was effectively dismantling British industry and the apprentice system, countries like Germany, Netherlands Belgium etc, etc, were and still are actively promoting and funding them!!

Try again, ...lol!!

Corrected that for you.

Immigration is the key to the falling saleries and pay at the lower end of the scale.

If you were an employer, looking to employ 100 staff, would you take on the highest paid? Of course you won't.

So take your blinkers off and smell the coffeee.

PS and what did New Labour do about apprenticeships for their "golden" 13 years - f all. All they wanted were degree caliber media studies 20's with huge debts.

Engineer54 · Feb 21, 2015

PS and what did New Labour do about apprenticeships for their "golden" 13 years - f all. All they wanted were degree caliber media studies 20's with huge debts.

Quite agree, they could of made a huge difference in this respect if they put their mind to it.

I don't bash any particular party, they in my mind are all the same, thinking more about the interests of the party, themselves and it's fund raisers, rather than the country interests to which they were elected to govern ....

As for your main post contents, that may well be true to a point, but i doubt very much if would have affected the trades side of things to the degree you imply. The immigrants normally took to low grade work/positions that no-body wanted to do unless literary forced to...

baldsparkies · Feb 21, 2015

The influx of European workers is driving down wages within the industry.
That with watering down of the importance of properly qualified persons.
If you come from a place that has a cost of living 1/5th of ours.
Your going to work for 1/2 the cost of a uk person, and be more than happy to do so.

Octopus · Feb 21, 2015

baldsparkies said:
The influx of European workers has and is driving down wages within the industry and this is ongoing.
That with watering down of the importance of properly qualified persons.
If you come from a place that has a cost of living 1/5th of ours.
Your going to work for 1/2 the cost of a uk person, and be more than happy to do so.

Corrected that for you!

Welchyboy1 · Feb 21, 2015

baldsparkies said:
Where house bashing is concerned, the incentive (not the need) for skilled tradesman is on a decline.
And I say that because I have seen the kind of work left behind by so called electricians.
Thankfully most of my bread and butter comes from the commercial sector, and that's a very different world.
No matter how you look at it, domestic is rife with semi skilled persons working for peanuts in a very competitive market.
You seriously need to look at the backgrounds of your Electrical Trainee's because like it or not most are not qualified time served electricians.
You see young lads chucking cables in, super fast, with a boss pressuring them to get in and get out all in the name of profit.
To pay JIB rates you have to be qualified to the rate.
And if your a qualified electrician what the hell are you doing house bashing for.

Your having a laugh aint you, the large scale commercial sector is where its happening the most, one bunch of monkeys installing the unistrutt, another doing the cabling, another for containment, another for second fixing

with only a handful of skilled people at the top taking the lead

its big commercial companies that have designed it to be this way!

for every real electrician on site there are a half dozen 'mates' or installers

again the only ones making any money are the blokes at the top taking on the contracts